Greek Government Press Briefing, 05-09-28

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From: The Hellenic Ministry of Press & Mass Media <http://www.minpress.gr/>

Aqhna, 28 Septembrioy 2005

APO TON YPOYRGO EPIKRATEIAS KAI KYBERNHTIKO EKPROSWPO

QEODWRO ROYSOPOYLO

Xairete.

O Prwqypoyrgos, ayrio stis 09:30, qa exei synergasia, sto Megaro Majimoy, me ton yfypoyrgo Aqlhtismoy k. Giwrgo Orfano.

Parakalw tis erwthseis sas.

BLAXOS: Kyrie Ekproswpe, mhpws qa qelate na mas peite gia thn enhmerwsh toy ellhnikoy laoy, tis ejelijeis opws aytes eginan apo th stigmh poy plhroforhqhkate oti boyleytes toy PASOK, me erwthsh toys, apokalyptan ta osa eipe o k. Regkoyzas, mexri to apogeyma poy o k. Regkoyzas epishmopoihse oti den qa einai ypo antikatastash kai qa einai sth qesh toy; Ti akribws synebh dhladh; Phrate thlefwno ton k. Regkoyza, toy eipate steile moy thn omilia soy, ti prepei na poyme ston Prwqypoyrgo, ti eipe o k. Regkoyzas se esas kai ton Prwqypoyrgo; Ola ayta mporeite na mas ta peite;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Oxi, den mporw na sas ta pw.

BLAXOS: Einai mystiko;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Den mporw na sas ta pw.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Mia apo tis megalyteres gallikes efhmerides apokalyce oti ypoyrgos sthn Ellada, to 2003, phre miza gia na prowqhsei thn etaireia ``QALHS'', h opoia exei kai edw grafeia kai ergostasio ap` o,ti emaqa, drasthriopoieitai sthn Ellada, na prowqhsei kapoies fregates, 6 ston ariqmo kai malista legetai oti phre miza 8 ekatommyria eyrw. H ellhnikh kybernhsh kai to ypoyrgeio Dikaiosynhs, mhpws prokeitai na kalesoyn ton kyrio ayton na kataqesei edw ti akribws egine kai poios einai o anqrwpos poy ta phre;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Ej oswn gnwrizw exei, hdh, katateqei erwthsh sth Boylh. Akoloyqeitai h koinoboyleytikh diadikasia kai qa yparjei apanthsh sth Boylh.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Egw lew gia thn kybernhsh, an qa kinhsei th diadikasia na kalesei ton kyrio ayton edw, stis ellhnikes dikastikes arxes na kataqesei.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Sas epanalambanw oti exei katateqei erwthsh sth Boylh. To armodio ypoyrgeio qa diejagei ereyna kai qa dwsei apanthsh sth Boylh. Analogws me thn apanthsh, qa kinhqoyn peraiterw ola ta zhthmata.

STAMATOPOYLOS: H erwthsh einai gia ton ypoyrgo Amynas. Egw lew gia to ypoyrgeio Dikaiosynhs, an kinhsei diadikasia stis gallikes arxes na steiloyn ayton ton kyrio na kataqesei.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Katalaba ti lete. Sas lew kai pali oti mia ypoqesh prwta prepei na diereynhqei. To armodio ypoyrgeio qa diereynhsei thn ypoqesh. Poly perissotero poy yparxei kai aithma apo th Boylh. Otan loipon apanthqei h ypoqesh sth Boylh, analogws ths apanthsews, qa mporoyme na janasyzhthsoyme to qema.

BLAXOS: Ti einai ayto poy baryne sto na mhn antikatastaqei sto ypoyrgeio o k. Regkoyzas meta tis ejhghseis poy hdh sas edwse sto Megaro Majimoy, se sas kai ston k. Karamanlh;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Exw apanthsei apo xqes sto qema meta apo pollaples erwthseis. Parakalw na diabasete th xqesinh politikh enhmerwsh.

BLAXOS: Den exete apanthsei sto erwthma, ti einai ayto poy baryne na mhn antikatastaqei, giati ap` o,ti katalabainw, kapoio xroniko diasthma htan xwris Ypoyrgeio.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Exw apanthsei sto qema.

BLAXOS: Gia to ``grhgoroshmo'' qa qelate na moy peite;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Exw apanthsei.

BLAXOS: Eipe cemata o k. Regkoyzas@;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Leipate xqes, alla mporw na sas promhqeysw me to xqesino briefing, gia na exete plhrh eikona.

BLAXOS: O k. Regkoyzas eipe cemata gia to ``grhgoroshmo'';

ROYSOPOYLOS: Exw apanthsei se ayto to qema.

SPYRAKH: Yparxei shmera enas qorybos gyrw apo mia egkyklio mallon epikairopoihshs ths efarmoghs ths nomoqesias gia thn eisprajh lhjiproqesmwn xrewn pros to dhmosio. Dhmioyrgeitai h entypwsh oti otan kapoios ofeilei, oi ofeiles metakyliontai stoys syggeneis toy, sta paidia toy, akomh kai sta eggonia toy. Toy pairnoyn, leei, th syntajh, toy pairnoyn to misqo, toy pairnoyn to spiti. Den exw antilhfqei. Epeidh pragmatika exei dhmioyrghqei enas panikos apo to prwi, qelw an yparxei h dynatothta na mas plhroforhsete analytika, ti akribws einai ayth h egkyklios.

ROYSOPOYLOS: H ekfrash ``dhmioyrgeitai mia entypwsh'' poy xrhsimopoihsate, apotypwnei thn pragmatikothta. An to paromoiaze kapoios diaforetika qa elege oti kapoioi anakalycan thn Amerikh, 500 xronia meta ton Kolombo. Yparxei to yp` ariqm. 356/74 nomoqetiko diatagma, to opoio isxyei edw kai 31 xronia. Malista to 1999 h prohgoymenh kybernhsh toy PASOK me Proedriko Diatagma symplhrwse ayto to nomoqetiko diatagma poy isxyei epi 31 xronia kai problepei pws ginontai oi eisprajeis ofeilwn pros to dhmosio. Sto Proedriko ayto Diatagma toy 1999, opws kai sto nomoqetiko toy 1974, yparxei seira apo diadikasies, poy orizoyn oti eidopoieitai apo ton eforo o ofeileths na katabalei to poso ths ofeilhs, eidopoieitai kai ginetai ryqmish na to katabalei me doseis k.o.k. Sthn akraia periptwsh poy o ofeileths den katabalei to poso, tote kineitai dikastikh diadikasia kai kaleitai na parei apofash h dikaiosynh. Se kaqe periptwsh, loipon, dhmioyrgoyntai entypwseis gia ena qema poy afora ton tropo leitoyrgias toy dhmosioy, gia to pws to dhmosio mporei na eisprajei ayta poy ofeiloyn orismenoi kai orizetai me nomoqetiko diatagma apo to 1974. Den exei tipota kainoyrio ayth h ypoqesh.

SPYRAKH: Me sygxwreite poy epanerxomai, alla prwton an isxyei, ti xreia exomen allhs egkyklioy kai deyteron yparxei h paradoxh toy ``oyk an labeis para toy mh exontos'', yparxoyn anqrwpoi poy profanws einai se pantelh adynamia na apodwsoyn ta ofeilomena. Ti qa ginei me aytoys; Qa hqela na moy apanthsete se ayta ta dyo erwthmata.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Sthn Ellada yparxoyn nomoi oi opoioi throyntai. Gia to sygkekrimeno qema yparxei nomoqetiko diatagma apo to 1974. Ti logo exei na ypomnhsqei me egkyklio to qema; Synhqizetai sto ellhniko dhmosio na ginontai ypomnhseis, opws synhqizetai sth dikh sas th doyleia, an kanete kapoio laqos, o dieyqynths na sas ypomnhsei oti den prepei na to janakanete thn epomenh fora; Einai kati, loipon, to opoio den exei tipota to kainoyrio, tipota to diaforetiko ap` o,ti isxye edw kai 31 xronia.

SPYRAKH: Gi` aytoys poy den exoyn th dynatothta@

ROYSOPOYLOS: Yparxoyn nomoi kai aytoi oi nomoi throyntai. Ean eseis xrwstate sthn eforia, ti kanete; Plhrwnete h oxi; Ean den mporeite na plhrwsete apaj to poson, kanete mia ryqmish me thn eforia. Ayta problepoyn oi nomoi kai oi egkyklioi stis opoies anaferqhkate. Den yparxei kamia tropopoihsh ths egkyklioy toy PASOK, den exei yparjei kamia allagh toy nomoqetikoy diatagmatos toy 1974.

SIDERHS: Egw qa akoloyqhsw ta xnaria, tis skeceis Regkoyza kai qa ginw realisths. Apo systasews toy ellhnikoy kratoys kaqe Kybernhsh diorize toys anqrwpoys ths sto dhmosio tomea. Omws einai anagkh na jeftilizontai aytoi poy pairnoyn meros stis diadikasies twn diagwnismwn; Diabazw mia tekmhriwmenh kataggelia toy boyleyth toy PASOK k. Mpolarh, poy leei oti gia thn Trapeza ths Ellados gia froyroi emeinan ap@ ejw anqrwpoi poy eixan 19 kai 20 sto ptyxio kai hjeran jenes glwsses kai mphkan anqrwpoi me 11 kai 14 sto apolythrio. As poyme oti qa mporoysan na htan froyroi. Qa mporoyse na htan bebaia qema swmatikwn prosontwn. Alla den htan oyte ayto. Oi epityxontes apanthsan epityxws sthn erwthsh ``poia htan h prwteyoysa ths Elladas'' kai ``poia einai h prwteyoysa toy nomoy Serrwn''. Den einai ypoxrewsh ths Politeias na katarghsei aytoys toys diagwnismoys gia na mhn apogohteyontai neoi anqrwpoi kai na mh niwqoyn oti toys koroideyei katamoytra h Politeia an oxi kai h Kybernhsh;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Opws gnwrizete yparxoyn ryqmiseis poy aforoyn to ASEP kai ryqmiseis poy pernoyn ektos ASEP. As poyme gia paradeigma, to qema poy anaferete gia froyroys se DEKO h se trapezes yparxei enas nomos apo to 1998 -to anakoinwse to ypoyrgeio Eswterikwn, nomizw oti tote htan ypoyrgos o k. Rwmaios- gia to pws ginontai oi proslhceis, pws ginetai h synenteyjh kai oytw kaqejhs. Akoloyqhqhkan oi nomoi. Den exw na pw tipote perissotero.

SIDERHS: Nai. Ta aisqhmata sas qa moy ta legate an phgainate na apanthsete se aythn thn erwthsh kai blepate oti petyxe stis proforikes ejetaseis kapoios poy apanthse sto poia einai h prwteyoysa ths Elladas;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Den qa sas elega ta aisqhmata moy. Me rwtate na sas apanthsw ws Kybernhtikos Ekproswpos, ti symbainei se mia sygkekrimenh periptwsh. Sas lew loipon oti akoloyqoyntai oi nomoi.

SOYGLERHS: Qelw na rwthsw ean pragmatika, giati aytes tis meres akoyw ta radiofwna, tis efhmerides kai stelexh toy PASOK na kathgoroyn syllhbdhn thn kybernhsh oti eimaste se periodo diorismwn ``galaziwn paidiwn''. Qelw etsi apla na moy apanthsete, eftase ayth h wra pragmati; H Kybernhsh diorizei galazia paidia; Kai poy kaqe mera kathgoreite sta kanalia kai sta radiofwna kai stis efhmerides;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Den qa sas apanthsw genikws kai aoristws. Qa sas pw oti yparxei mia seira diagwnismwn. Lambanoyn meros oloi oi Ellhnes polites poy exoyn dikaiwma na laboyn h poy qeloyn na laboyn kai analogws me to diagwnismo, analogws me tis ejetaseis, proxwroyn oi epityxontes kai menoyn pisw oi apotyxontes.

BLAXOS: Anagnwrizw th filotimh prospaqeia poy kanete, na kleisete to qema Regkoyza, egw omws qa epimeinw. Kai qa epimeinw sto ejhs: Symfwna me plhrofories poy exoyn phgh to Ypoyrgeio, yparxei ayth th stigmh mia ierh symmaxia metajy prasinwn kai galaziwn telwneiakwn, enantion toy k. Regkoyza, dioti ypotiqetai oti ypegrace kapoies metakinhseis dieyqyntwn kai oi opoioi pia kanoyn ayth thn epiqesh enantion toy Ypoyrgoy. H Kybernhsh, to Majimoy, o Prwqypoyrgos, qewrei oti mesa sthn prospaqeia yponomeyshs toy k. Regkoyza einai kai anqrwpoi poy anhkoyn sto xwro ths Neas Dhmokratias;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Den qa mpw se qewries synomwsias. Ekeino to opoio anakoinwqhke kai apo ton k. Regkoyza kai to epanelaba kai egw xqes edw, einai oti synepese thn hmera poy eginan aytes oi metakinhseis -tis opoies eixe diatajei na ginoyn edw kai polloys mhnes kai den ginontoysan- na exoyme kai ayth thn erwthsh. Kai eixa pei malista xqes: Ta symperasmata dika sas.

BLAXOS: Aytoi oi 24 omws, htan anqrwpoi poy eixan mpei epi Kybernhsews ths Neas Dhmokratias, apo ton k. Regkoyza kai qewroyntai anqrwpoi ths Neas Dhmokratias, ths DAKE.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Den to gnwrizw, alla ean isxyei ayto to opoio lete, einai mia akomh apodeijh oti den yparxei kamia diakrish sto dhmosio tomea yper h kata kapoiwn.

BLAXOS: Alla stoixeioqetei omws thn ennoia ths synomwsias.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Sas epanalambanw oti an isxyei ayto poy lete, einai pros timhn ths shmerinhs Kybernhshs kai twn Ypoyrgwn ths oti den kanoyn diakriseis stis metakinhseis twn dieyqyntikwn stelexwn. Ginontai mono me kaqara yphresiaka krithria.

BLAXOS: O k. Regkoyzas qa einai kai sto epomeno kybernhtiko sxhma meta tis allages poy qa kanei o Prwqypoyrgos;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Se ayto to qema o monos armodios gia na apanthsei einai o Prwqypoyrgos, den eimai egw.

POYLIDOY: Kyrie Ypoyrge, moy kanei entypwsh pws omologei o k. Regkoyzas oti mia entolh poy exei dwsei prin apo tesseris mhnes, ws Proistamenh Politikh Arxh, den ylopoieitai epi tesseris mhnes. Ti pragma dikaiologei akribws; Thn aneparkeia toy na dioikhsei to Ypoyrgeio;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Den jerw, an einai tesseris mhnes. O xronos einai ligoteros, einai apo ton Ioylio. Den gnwrizw poies akribws einai oi diadikasies poy akoloyqoyntai. Einai bebaio pantws oti sthn prokeimenh periptwsh oi diadikasies poy eprepe na akoloyqhqoyn se syntomo xroniko diasthma, den akoloyqhqhkan. Ti eidoys proskommata h kwlymata mporei na eyreqoyn h na efeyreqoyn sthn poreia, den mporw na gnwrizw, giati oi ypallhloi sth dhmosia dioikhsh, opws gnwrizete, dikaiwmata kai ypoxrewseis. Metajy twn dikaiwmatwn mporei na einai mia prosfygh se ena anwtero organo gia na anakalesei o politikos proistamenos thn entolh thn opoia exei dwsei. Ean loipon kapoioi qigontai kai qewrhsan oti prepei na prosfygoyn, den to gnwrizw. Mporei kai na exei ginei. Einai ena poly eidiko qema.

BLAXOS: Epi toy qematos. Giati o k. Regkoyzas leei oti kratoysan ayto to apomagnhtofwnhmeno keimeno kai ayth thn kaseta gia na ton ekbiazoyn, prokeimenoy na mhn proxwrhsoyn oi metaqeseis. Kai phge thn perasmenh ebdomada kai apeilhse ayton poy kratoyse sto syrtari toy, anqrwpo ths Neas Dhmokratias, tis metaqeseis kai toy eipe bgaltes alliws qa breis to mpela soy. Kai tis ebgale kai jafnika emfanisthkan oloi na lene gia to ti egine ton perasmeno Ioynio. Eseis ayto, ap@ oti katalabainw, sas to eipe sto Megaro Majimoy, giati to leei pantoy o k. Regkoyzas, to qewreite peistiko; Gi ayto emeine o k. Regkoyzas sth qesh toy;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Moy kanate me diaforetiko tropo, ofeilw na omologhsw pio ejypna, thn prwth sas erwthsh. Den qa apanthsw.

KORAH: Kai egw qa epimeinw sto qema toy k. Regkoyza. Afhse na ennohqei oti yparxoyn symferonta pisw apo thn olh diastash poy phre to qema ths omilias toy. Anarwtiemai ti eidoys symferonta yparxoyn, poy exoyn qigei, otan sthn oysia den exei qigei kanenas. Dioti me bash ta epishma stoixeia ths Kybernhshs sas, yparxei mia foberh ysterhsh esodwn h opoia, an den kanw laqos einai sthn armodiothta toy k. Regkoyza. Ara, afoy den ta phre sthn oysia apo kanenan, poios exei enoxlhqei ektos apo ton k. Regkoyza;

ROYSOPOYLOS: H erwthsh sas, qa mporoyse na apotelei apanthsh sto erwthma ths k. Spyrakh. Giati as poyme, stis 22 Septembrioy, poly protoy jekinhsei to qema ayto poy mas apasxolhse tis teleytaies dyo hmeres me ton Yfypoyrgo Oikonomias, kanontas th doyleia toy kai kanontas thn swsta, apesteile egkyklio gia th syllogh, th sygkentrwsh twn xrhmatwn poy ofeilontai sto ellhniko dhmosio.

PALAIOLOGOS: Ep` aytoy. Gia to qema Regkoyza, h mallon gia ta aponera toy qematos Regkoyza. Exei ginei kapoia ereyna; Exei diataxqei kapoia ereyna, meta apo ayta poy feretai na eipe o syndikalisths ths DAKE o k. Nikolarakos, gia kapoia sarantaria konteiner poy feygane@

ROYSOPOYLOS: Den to gnwrizw.

KORAH: Kai xqes to idio mas eipate.

GKOYTZANHS: Telika, o k. Regkoyzas edwse ejhghseis se esas kai ston Prwqypoyrgo h oxi;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Exw hdh apanthsei.

GKOYTZANHS: Epeidh xqes eipate oti exei dwsei ejhghseis ston proistameno Ypoyrgo toy. Gi ayto.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Exw hdh apanthsei.

TSIODRAS: Sxetika me thn diadikasia twn proslhcewn, eipate oti akoloyqoyntai oi nomoi. Oi nomoi profanws problepoyn thn prosmetrhsh toy apolythrioy kai kapoies synenteyjeis. Den problepoyn ton sygkekrimeno typo erwthsewn kai to sygkekrimeno typo baqmologhshs. Dhladh to na baqmologeitai kapoios epeidh apanthse sto poia einai h prwteyoysa, h Aqhna me toso baqmo kai na jepernaei kapoion allon poy apantaei sthn idia erwthsh. Ep` aytoy kai epi ths oysias twn synenteyjewn kai aytwn poy kataggellete exete kati;

ROYSOPOYLOS: To qema ayto, apo th stigmh poy jekinhse, apo to 1998, apasxolei gia prwth fora thn koinh gnwmh. Prwton, einai periergo, pws jafnika apasxolei thn koinh gnwmh kati poy isxyei edw kai efta oloklhra xronia. Me ton idio tropo ginontoysan ews twra oi proslhceis fylakwn stis DEKO kai stis trapezes. Deyteron, oson afora th synenteyjh -kai einai rhtorikh h erwthsh- synhqws oi perissoteroi ek twn Ellhnwn den lene oti to ellhniko dhmosio den leitoyrgei swsta; Polles fores to akoyei kapoios. Epishs lene oi idioi anqrwpoi oti oi idiwtikes epixeirhseis leitoyrgoyn kalytera. Kai qa rwthsw rhtorika: Gnwrizete kapoia idiwtikh epixeirhsh, h opoia den kalei se synenteyjh ton opoiondhpote poy prokeitai na proslabei; Pws loipon apo th mia anagnwrizoyme oti leitoyrgoyn kalytera oi idiwtikes epixeirhseis, qewrwntas oti systatiko stoixeio ths proslhchs einai kai h synenteyjh -kai milaw genikws gia th synenteyjh giati exei ginei polys qorybos teleytaia- kai apo thn allh ayto to stoixeio eksygxronismoy, ekmonternismoy toy kratoys, to opoio enetaxqh me bash to gnwsto nomo toy k. Paylopoyloy kai stis ejetaseis toy Dhmosioy, to aporriptoyme diarrhdhn; Exei mia antifash ayto.

TSIODRAS: Otan kaneis mia synenteyjh se mia idiwtikh epixeirhsh profanws pairneis ton kalytero prokeimenoy na exeis kerdh, na trejei h epixeirhsh soy. Sto dhmosio den to kaneis h toylaxiston mexri twra exei fanei oti h ekastote kybernhsh den kathgorw thn kybernhsh ths N.D. kai h kybernhsh toy PASOK exei kanei, edw kai 20 xronia poly perissotera apo ayta poy kathgorei twra ths N.D ekei, omws, ginetai me kommatika krithria. Dhladh, h synenteyjh otan ginetai me tetoia krithria baqmologhshs kaneis den mas eggyatai oti ginetai gia na proslhfqei o kalyteros. Ap` o,ti fainetai synexizei, opws ginotan apo to 1998 mexri twra kai apo to 2004 mexri shmera, na proslambanontai aytoi poy einai toy ekastote kommatos.

ROYSOPOYLOS: H prospaqeia einai na ginetai me ton kalytero dynato tropo. Kai einai mia prospaqeia -opws jerete- poy qa diarkesei para poly xrono. Den einai eykolo. Den allazoyn oi nootropies, opws sas elega kai xqes gia allo qema.

KORAH: Epeidh akribws anagnwrizete ap` oti blepw eseis tis adynamies ths sygkekrimenhs synenteyjhs, poia einai h prwteyoysa ths Elladas, as poyme h Qessalonikh, aisqaneste san nea diakybernhsh, opws qelete na prosdiorizeste, na allajete to plaisio ayto twn synenteyjewn poy pragmatika einai asteies kai dhmioyrgoyn polla erwthmatika;

ROYSOPOYLOS: H kybernhsh kanei mia seira apo qesmikes allages. Qewroyme oti einai shmantikh qesmikh allagh h eisagwgh ths synenteyjhs gia thn proslhch.

KORAH: Milame gia to plaisio sth sygkekrimenh periptwsh.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Gia to plaisio milame. O rolos ths kybernhshs einai na kanei qesmikes parembaseis, qesmikes allages. Epishs, h kybernhsh kai oi armodioi paragontes na elegxoyn, sth synexeia, kata poson ola osa o nomoqeths exei problecei, ginontai qesmika kalytera ap` oti ginontoysan. Kai pragmatika ginontai kalytera. Den exw na pw kati perissotero. Eipa oti ginontai oi qesmikes allages kai synexizontai. Xreiazetai prospaqeia, xronos kai polys kopos.

KAKALHS: Afhsate na ennohqei oti zhleyete ton tropo proslhchs ston idiwtiko tomea, se sxesh me to dhmosio. Qelete na peite oti yparxoyn kalyteroi kanones ajiokratias ston idiwtiko tomea, otan einai fanero oti kanei to afentiko ayto poy qelei se mia idiwtikh epixeirhsh. Dhladh, poio einai to krithria ths ajiokratias.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Kanete mia poly genikh kai mallon aforistikh topoqethsh.

KAKALHS: Dikh sas htan h topoqethsh.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Den eipa ayto poy lete. Eseis ermhneysate me to diko sas tropo, apo th dikh sas optikh gwnia ayto poy eipa. Nomizw oti oi perissoteroi ek twn paristamenwn poy ergazontai se idiwtika MME den symmerizontai thn idia apoch. Eipa kati poly sygkekrimeno: Legetai, akoygetai edw kai xronia, oti to ellhniko dhmosio exei mia seira apo problhmata. Metajy twn problhmatwn aytwn einai o tropos leitoyrgias toy. Legetai, epishs, oti polles idiwtikes epixeirhseis leitoyrgoyn poly kalytera ap` oti to dhmosio. Kai anarwthqhka, rhtoriko htan to erwthma. Yparxei idiwtikh epixeirhsh poy na proslabei kapoion xwris na ton kalesei prin se synenteyjh; Gia paradeigma, o armodios dieyqynths eidhsewn gia dhmosiografo, o dieyqynths proswpikoy, an prokeitai gia mia biomhxania k.o.k. Ara, loipon, epanalambanw: Kati poy exei eisaxqei se alles xwres, poly prin apo emas, kati to opoio sthn Ellada leitoyrgei ston idiwtiko tomea, otan eisagetai sto dhmosio antilambanomai oti yparxei kapoioy eidoys kaxypocia. Anaferqhkan prohgoymenws h k. Korah kai o k. Tsiodras se aytes. Tis antilambanomai. Wstoso, einai ena bhma pros ta empros. Ena bhma poy xreiazetai polys xronos gia na empedwqei, gia na ginei sthn prajh oso pio antikeimenika kai kalytera ginetai.

KAKALHS: Dhladh, ektos apo tis ergasiakes sxeseis toy idiwtiko tomea poy prowqeite sto dhmosio twra prowqeite kai toys tropoys proslhchs.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Gia ena qema poy exei oloklhrwqei hdh sth Boylh, phra aformh apo mia erwthsh synadelfoy sas, na kanw mia genikoterh anafora sta zhthmata ths synenteyjhs.

IWANNOY: Prin apo ligh wra katateqhke mia erwthsh sth Boylh, basei ths opoias mia qygatrikh etaireia ths O.A. nomizw o ``Galilaios'' proxwra se proslhceis proswpikoy. Hdh yparxoyn kapoies dhlwseis boyleytwn toy PASOK poy kaloyn thn kybernhsh kai ton k. Liaph na stamathsei ayth th diadikasia. Gnwrizete ean ginontai proslhceis kai gia poio logo;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Epikoinwnhsa me ton k. Liaph kai h apanthsh einai kathgorhmatikh: Den ginontai, oyte prokeitai na ginoyn tetoies proslhceis.

SPYRAKH: Epeidh xqes eidame sthn epikairothta mia eikona, thn opoia eseis qa krinete, se sxesh me to kybernhtiko stratopedo. O k. Ebert, afhse safeis aixmes se baros toy k. M. Kefalogiannh, ypoyrgoy Naytilias, se sxesh me ton tropo poy metaxeirizetai thn naytoploia kai tis sxeseis poy exei me toys efoplistes. O k. Panagiwtopoylos kathgoreitai apo synadelfoys toy sth B` Perifereia ths Aqhnas, oti tis 443 qeseis poy prokhryje gia symboyloys ergasias ston OAED den tis dhmosiopoihse deontws kai tis krathse gia ton eayto toy. Den sas lew gia to pws dixasthke -opws apotypwnetai shmera sto Typo- h N.D. gia to qema Regkoyza, oyte gia to pws syzhteitai se epipedo koinoboyleytikhs omadas h apofash toy k. Tatoylh na aqwwsei eayton. Qelw na moy peite, ean synolika o Prwqypoyrgos einai ikanopoihmenos apo thn eikona ths kybernhshs h skeftetai isws na kanei systash, na pei kati;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Exw treis parathrhseis: Prwton, sas exw pei polles fores oti den qa sas lew ean o Prwqypoyrgos einai h den einai ikanopoihmenos gia to opoiodhpote qema. Deyteron, sas exw pei oti otan katatiqentai erwthseis sth Boylh, aytes apantwntai apo toys armodioys ypoyrgoys. Triton, rwthqhka gia qema poy afora -symfwna me dhmosieyma ths @LE MONDE@- prwhn ypoyrgo toy PASOK kai apanthsa me ton idio tropo. Eipa, loipon, oti h Boylh sthn koinoboyleytikh diadikasia poy problepetai qa labei thn apanthsh apo ton armodio ypoyrgo. Poly perissotero, loipon, qa sas pw oti gia ypoyrgoys ths kybernhshs qa doqei h apanthsh. Se kaqe periptwsh -kai ayth einai h teleytaia moy parathrhsh- kaqe boyleyths einai eleyqeros na erwta kai na lambanei apanthseis, opws problepei to Syntagma kai o Kanonismos ths Boylhs. H kybernhsh pisteyei oti kineitai sth swsth kateyqynsh. H kybernhsh pisteyei oti prospaqei -kai prospaqei poly- na lysei polla kai xronia problhmata. Ean yparxoyn oi opoies mikres paralhceis h elleiceis, tetoioy eidoys epishmanseis mas bohqoyn na ginoyme akoma kalyteroi.

GARGALAKOS: Kyrie Ypoyrge, xronia o dhmosios tomeas aimorragei, qa elega, mesa apo tis mh ajiokratikes diadikasies me tis opoies stelexwnetai. Hqela na sas kanw ena erwthma, poy to exw janakanei se esas, mhnes prin: H kybernhsh sas epidiwkei na stelexwsei ton dhmosio tomea ajiokratika; Synexizetai na apantate ``nai'' s` ayto;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Synexizw na apantw nai me thn prosqhkh twn oswn exw pei ki alles fores kai epanelaba kai shmera: Einai mia diadikasia h opoia xreiazetai para poly xrono gia na empedwqei.

GARGALAKOS: Na sas rwthsw tote kati allo: H ajiokratia ektos apo to ypokeimeniko stoixeio ths synenteyjhs, poy to ajiologei h opoia epitroph opws qelei, emperiexei kai antikeimenika stoixeia. Gia paradeigma, exoyme ta biografika, epeidh anaferqhkate kai se idiwtikes etaireies. H idiwtikh etaireia prwta koitazei to biografiko toy ypochfioy. Enas ypochfios poy exei 20, poy jerei jenes glwsses, enanti enos ypochfioy poy exei 11, poy den jerei jenes glwsses, profanws yperterei. Kai ayto to antikeimeniko krithrio anatrepetai mesa apo th synenteyjh h opoia den einai kai kanenas maraqwnios gnwsewn. H synenteyjh, opws fanhke apo tis erwthseis, den mporei na anatrecei ayth thn antikeimenikh eikona. Pws to dikaiologeite, afoy lete oti h kybernhsh sas einai yper ths ajiokratias;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Sto qema anaferqhke xqes analytika o ypoyrgos Dhmosias Tajhs k. Boylgarakhs. Eipe epipleon kapoia pragmata ta opoia isws den ta parakoloyqhsate kai qa moy epitrecete na ta epanalabw. Eipe oti eidan to fws ths dhmosiothtas apospasmata apo thn synenteyjh, enw h synenteyjh htan poly megalyterh se diarkeia kai se erwthseis. Kai eipe oti eidika gia ton xwro ayto me nomo -edw kai polla xronia, eipa kai prin, isxyei ayth h diadikasia- otan kapoios anqrwpos etoimazetai na ferei oplo, krinetai sth synenteyjh, ean einai ikanos h oxi na ferei oplo. Den einai kat` anagkhn enas h dyo oi logoi, einai polloi. Bebaiws, apostasiopoihmena, apokommena etsi opws anaferate sthn erwthsh sas to qema, qa mporoyse kaneis na apanthsei me amfibolies. Se kaqe periptwsh omws, otan apokoptoyme ena qema apo to synolo, tote sigoyra odhgoymaste se lanqasmena symperasmata.

KORAH: Me bash ta teleytaia stoixeia ths Eurostat gia thn ellhnikh oikonomia, shmera mporeite na eiste kathgorhmatikos oti den qa parete nea metra, poy shmainei neoys foroys;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Isxyei h apanthsh poy eixa dwsei kai edw prin apo liges ebdomades, alla kai xqes.

KORAH: Mporeite na moy freskarete th mnhmh;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Afoy apanthsa kai xqes den xreiazeste ``freskarisma''.

GKOYTZANHS: Kyrie Ekproswpe, na mhn epanalaboyme tis ypoqeseis, alla edw kai dyo ebdomades eixame tis teleytaies -opws eipe prohgoymenws kai h synadelfos- twn Ebert kai Kefalogiannh, boyleytes gia Panagiwtopoylo, qema Regkoyza, thn prohgoymenh ebdomada qema Palaiokrassa me toys dyo ypoyrgoys, genikws deixnei edw kai dyo ebdomades oti h kybernhsh exei kapoia problhmata ``etairikhs diakybernhshs'', opws eixate pei eseis palaiotera gia th DEH. Kapoia problhmata dysleitoyrgias, kapoia problhmata elleichs syntonismoy. Skopeyei na kanei kati gi` ayto o Prwqypoyrgos h qa afhsei na diaiwnizontai kai na parateinontai;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Den gnwrizw polla merh toy kosmoy h en pash periptwsei polles meres sth zwh mas poy na mhn yparxoyn problhmata. Pantoy kai panta yparxoyn problhmata. Exei shmasia poso shmantika einai ayta ta problhmata. Exei shmasia an ta problhmata ayta ta diaxeirizetai kaneis me epityxia, ean sta problhmata ayta ta opoia einai mesa sth zwh, opws legame kai tis proalles, mporeis na antepejelqeis.

GKOYTZANHS: Synhqismena problhmata einai ola ayta kyrie Ekproswpe;

SIDERHS: Giati to exete rijei sth filosofia twra teleytaia;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Stis anqrwpines sxeseis fysika kai yparxoyn problhmata. Moy anaferate mia seira apo problhmata sto tade dioikhtiko symboylio h sto deina. Bebaiws, panta qa yparxoyn diaforetikes apoceis. Eytyxws poy yparxoyn diaforetikes apoceis kai eytyxws poy me dialogo brisketai h kalyterh lysh. O monologos kai h apofash ek twn anw, opws katalabainete, den einai kai h orqoterh.

GKOYTZANHS: Synepws oyden problhma. Na symperanw oti einai synhqismena problhmata poy den yparxei kai qema gi` ayta;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Sas to exw hdh pei.

BLAXOS: Proistamenos ypoyrgos toy k. Regkoyza einai o k. Alogoskoyfhs, o opoios rwthqhke sthn Amerikh gia to qema ayto kai arnhqhke na apanthsei. Epraje kalws, eprepe na kalycei ton k. Regkoyza, ton afhnei ekteqeimeno, pws to krinete;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Den qa krinw an dexqhke h arnhqhke na apanthsei se ena qema o ypoyrgos Oikonomias. To qema exei apanthqei eparkws sth synanthsh poy kaname kai xqes kai shmera edw.

BLAXOS: Logika den qa eprepe o proistamenos Ypoyrgos na ton kalycei h na ton apodokimasei;

ROYSOPOYLOS: To oti den hqele na milhsei kaqoloy gia to qema ayto o k. Alogoskoyfhs, to apodidw sto oti to qema ayto exei lhjei.

PALAIOLOGOS: Epeidh anagnwrisate ki eseis o idios oti yparxoyn diafora problhmata kai diaforetikes apoceis poy eytyxws -eipate- kalws yparxoyn.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Fantazomai ki eseis to anagnwrizete.

PALAIOLOGOS: Fysika to anagnwrizw, gi` ayto kai lew: Mhpws telika exei diatypwqei h skech sto Megaro Majimoy@

ROYSOPOYLOS: Na mhn yparxoyn kaqoloy problhmata dia nomoy; Den ginetai.

PALAIOLOGOS: Oxi, oxi. An xreiazetai telika na yparjei posto syntonisth h enas rolos, opoy kapoios anqrwpos, kapoios yper-ypoyrgos h kapoios me perissoteres ejoysies apo toys alloys ypoyrgoys, na mporei na syntonizei tis diaforetikes apoceis;

ROYSOPOYLOS: Einai mia erwthsh poy prepei na apeyqynqei ston Prwqypoyrgo. O syntonismos anhkei ston Prwqypoyrgo.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Prohgoymenws eipate oti h synenteyjh yphrxe kai epi PASOK klp. Giati; Ginontoysan diagwnismoi epi PASOK; Mono h prasinh taytothta ths kladikhs, tipota allo. Me ayto proslambanontoysan.

ROYSOPOYLOS: Exei ginei mia seira apo anafores kai kataggelies sth Boylh polles fores. Den qelw na epanelqw se ayto to qema.

Sas eyxaristw.

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