Greek Government Press Briefing, 99-11-18

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From: The Hellenic Ministry of Press & Mass Media <http://www.minpress.gr/>

YPOYRGEIO TYPOY & MESWN MAZIKHS ENHMERWSHS

Aqhna, 18 Noembrioy 1999

Geia sas.

Akoyw tis erwthseis sas.

LEONTOPOYLOS: Shmera h ayrio, prokeitai na ypografei sthn Toyrkia h shmantikotath symfwnia kataskeyhs toy petrelaiagwgoy Mpakoy-Seixan. Sxetikes plhrofories kanoyn logo gia apokleismo, toylaxiston pros to paron, gia kaqara strathgikoys logoys, ths dhmioyrgias toy agwgoy pros to Noborosir. An ejairesoyme to gegonos oti h ypografh ayth synista terastia anabaqmish ths Toyrkias, den nomizete oti paramenei pisw h kataskeyh toy agwgoy Mpoyrgkas-Alejandroypolh, h opoia toso endiefere thn Aqhna kai endexomenws, na apoteloyse symplhrwmatiko meso askhshs politikhs propagandas, en kairw; H kentrikh moy erwthsh einai, ti proetoimasies exei kanei h Aqhna gia na antimetwpisei tyxon arnhtikes synepeies apo ayth thn toso shmantikh ejelijh.

NIKOLAOY: Opws gnwrizete, emeis den eixame diatypwsei pote th qewria kai thn apoch oti prepei na yparxei enas mono agwgos, ayton poy emeis epiqymoyme kai pisteyoyme oti qa ylopoihqei, dhladh, o agwgos Mpoyrgkas-Alejandroypolhs, poy eseis anaferate. Den eixame pote diatypwsei th qewria ths mias lyshs. H apoch mas einai oti prepei na yparxoyn polloi kai enallaktikoi dromoi twn petrelaiwn. Kai h apoch mas paramenei staqerh.

KONTOPOYLOS: Yparxei mia protash apo ton k. Alabano, na ginei xrhsh ths asylias poy diaqetoyn oi boyleytes kai oi eyrwboyleytes, gia na perasoyn ta astynomika mploka se sygkekrimena shmeia, opoy qa apagoreyetai h kykloforia logw ths kinhshs toy Proedroy Klinton, etsi wste na perasoyn kai na dwsoyn kapoio mhnyma diamartyrias. H kybernhsh pws skeftetai na antimetwpisei mia endexomenh tetoia prwtoboylia;

NIKOLAOY: Kat` arxhn, h protash toy k. Alabanoy pros poion apeyqynetai; Fantazomai oti den apeyqynetai sthn kybernhsh.

KONTOPOYLOS: Pros toys Ellhnes boyleytes kai eyrwboyleytes.

NIKOLAOY: Emeis exoyme, ejarxhs, tonisei oti to dikaiwma twn Ellhnwn politwn na diadhlwnoyn kai na ekfrazoyn thn apoch toys kai thn pisth toys gia orismena qemata poy ekeinoi nomizoyn, einai anafaireto kai katoxyrwmeno syntagmatika. Threitai panta sth dhmokratikh Ellada. Taytoxrona, h Politeia ofeilei na diasfalisei to kyros kai ta symferonta ths xwras, otan exei enan ychlo proskeklhmeno, opws epishs na parexei thn asfaleia kai opwsdhpote to omalo edafos panw sto opoio qa diejaxqoyn oi synomilies, oi shmantikes synomilies gia th xwra kai ta symferonta ths. Yparxoyn polloi tropoi gia na deijei kaneis thn aneyqynh stash toy. Qa mporoysa na sas pw kai alloys. Ayto poy h kybernhsh kai dia stomatos Prwqypoyrgoy exei tonisei, einai oti yparxei mprosta mas mia proklhsh eyqynhs tis epomenes hmeres, h opoia -epanalambanw- einai eyqynh pros ofelos ths xwras kai oxi enos ekastoy proswpika, oyte kaqe kommatos jexwrista. Einai gnwsto, oti kapoioi sth xwra mas asxoloyntai me thn mikropolitikh. Emeis den asxoloymaste me thn mikropolitikh, asxoloymaste me thn politikh kai me thn proaspish twn symferontwn ths xwras. Osoi asxoloyntai me thn mikropolitikh, as synexisoyn na to kanoyn.

KONTOPOYLOS: As to doyme praktika, peran apo to ean einai politikh h mikropolitikh, an enas anqrwpos epixeirhsei na perasei ta astynomika mploka kai epikalestei th boyleytikh toy h thn eyrwboyleytikh toy asylia, h kybernhsh ti qa kanei praktika; Pws qa to antimetwpisei;

NIKOLAOY: Yparxoyn, opws jerete, nomoi sth xwra, oi opoioi throyntai. Den einai qema kybernhtikhs apofashs, oyte kybernhtikhs eyqynhs. Einai qema thrhshs twn nomwn me toys opoioys leitoyrgei syntetagmena h ellhnikh Politeia. Oi nomoi aforoyn oloys. Epanalambanw, omws, oti yparxoyn para polloi tropoi gia na katadeijei kaneis thn aneyqynothta toy.

KARGOYDH: Mhpws exete na mas metaferete mia epishmh eikona twn apotelesmatwn ths synanthshs toy k. Shmith me ton k. Etzebit;

NIKOLAOY: Qa parakalesw na mhn epektaqoyme se ayth th syzhthsh, edw, ypo thn ennoia oti exoyn ginei dhlwseis toy Prwqypoyrgoy sthn Kwnstantinoypolh. Fantazomai oti qa sas exoyn dianemhqei. Epishs, gnwrizete oti yparxei polymelhs ellhnikh apostolh ekei, einai o k. Reppas ekei, einai oi synadelfoi sas poy mporoyn na maqoyn perissotera pragmata apo thn Kwnstantinoypolh.

MIXAHL: Afoy kapoioi edw asxoloyntai me thn mikrokommatikh, enw h kybernhsh den asxoleitai me aythn, alla me thn oysia, mporeite na mas peite, ti qa prajei h kybernhsh sthn periptwsh poy o k. Klinton zhthsei apo thn Ellada ypoxwrhseis, etsi wste, kata thn apoch toy, na beltiwqei akomh perissotero to klima stis sxeseis Elladas-Toyrkias;

NIKOLAOY: Kat` arxhn, giati na ypoqesoyme oti o Proedros twn HPA qa zhthsei apo thn Ellada ypoxwrhseis...

MIXAHL: Giati aploystata to ekane pantoy.

NIKOLAOY:... otan gnwrizei poly kala -kai h xwra mas dia stomatos toy Prwqypoyrgoy exei epaneilhmmena anakoinwsei kai dhlwsei- oti h Ellada ekane tis kinhseis kalhs qelhshs poy mporoyse na kanei kai oti twra h eyqynh anhkei sthn allh pleyra. Epanalambanw, oi synomilies me ton Proedro twn HPA einai ena poly shmantiko qema. H kybernhsh asxoleitai poly sobara me thn ypoqesh ayth. Kai prosdoka beltiwsh twn ellhnoamerikanikwn sxesewn kai bebaiws, katanohsh -kai giati oxi- kai apodoxh twn qesewn ths gia ta qemata ths perioxhs. H apanthsh, dhladh, poy qa mporoyse na doqei me mia frash einai oti h kybernhsh qa proaspisei ta ellhnika symferonta, opws allwste kanei panta.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Milhsate, prohgoymenws, gia dhmokratikh Ellada. Efoson exoyme dhmokratikh Ellada, giati xrhsimopoioyntai nomoi ths xoyntas gia tis apagoreyseis twn kinhtopoihsewn;

NIKOLAOY: Kat` arxhn, prepei na gnwrizete oti yparxoyn syntagmatikes diatajeis oi opoies ryqmizoyn ta qemata ayta.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Toy astynomikoy dieyqynth, omws, sthrizetai se xoyntikes diatajeis.

NIKOLAOY: Aytes oi syntagmatikes diatajeis prepei na ginontai sebastes. Ofeiloyme na sebomaste to Syntagma mas kai toys nomoys mas. Me thn eykairia, qelw na pw oti sth xwra mas, apo orismenes pleyres, yparxei mia epilektikh eyaisqhsia. Sas qymizw, gia paradeigma, oti sthn episkech toy tote Proedroy twn HPA k. Mpoys, oydeis epediwje na kanei poreia sthn Amerikanikh Presbeia kai oydeis, epishs, epediwje na dhmioyrghsei ena tetoio qema san ki ayto poy epixeireitai apo orismenoys kykloys na dhmioyrghqei tis epomenes hmeres sth xwra mas. Bebaiws, emeis exoyme thn apoch mas. Qewroyme oti tote htan o "gamos" toy 1989, o opoios htan tote en zwh. O ellhnikos laos krinei, exei mnhmh, gnwrizei thn ellhnikh istoria, exei krish. Oloi krinomaste.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Den eixe prohghqei Kossobo to 1989.

NIKOLAOY: An katalabainw kala ti ennoeite me thn erwthsh sas...

STAMATOPOYLOS: Ennow, oti den eixe prohghqei ayth h sfagh apo ayton ton Proedro twn HPA.

NIKOLAOY: Qewreite fantazomai oti o rolos twn HPA, kata aytoys poy to isxyrizontai, allaje dramatika ta teleytaia xronia, meta to Kossobo, enw prin to Kossobo htan diaforetikos. Einai mia ekdoxh ayth. Emeis qewroyme oti oi HPA exoyn strathgika symferonta. Ta strathgika toys symferonta einai ta idia. H xwra mas exei, epishs, strathgika symferonta, ta opoia einai epishs staqera kai adiapragmateyta. Ayto to dedomeno apotelei th bash twn ellhnoamerikanikwn syzhthsewn kai th bash antimetwpishs olwn twn epimeroys peristatikwn. An kapoioi pisteyoyn oti oi HPA allajan thn politikh toys ta teleytaia dyo xronia, einai mia sebasth ektimhsh. Na bgoyn na thn poyn, omws, oti o Proedros Mpoys htan enas kalos Proedros, kata aytoys, enw o Proedros Klinton einai enas kakos Proedros.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Dhladh, eseis nomizete oti den exoyn kamia sxesh me to Kossobo oi diamartyries aytes;

NIKOLAOY: Emeis antimetwpizoyme ta qemata ayta apo qesh arxhs kai oxi apo qesh mikrokommatikhs, peristasiakhs ekmetalleyshs. Oi sxeseis mas me tis HPA kaqorizontai apo ta symferonta ths xwras, to rolo twn HPA ws megalhs dynamhs kai thn anagkh na synomiloyme mazi toys kai na prospaqoyme na kataktoyme, oso to dynaton perissotera, gia ta eqnika mas symferonta. Ayth einai mia qesh arxhs.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Exete katakthsei polla;

NIKOLAOY: Nai. H apanthsh einai nai.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Mporeite na mas peite ayta poy exete katakthsei apo th shmerinh politikh hgesia ektos apo ta eyxaristhria gia ta Imia;

NIKOLAOY: H xwra exei katakthsei polla. To basiko poy exei katakthsei einai oti anagnwrizetai apo th Dieqnh Koinothta, o rolos poy diadramatizei sthn perioxh. Kai den xreiazetai na rwthsete emena na sas to pw. Diabaste ta dhmosieymata toy jenoy Typoy -poy fantazomai oti parakoloyqeite ola ayta ta teleytaia xronia- gia na deite, an exei anabaqmistei h oxi h eikona ths xwras kai o rolos poy tis apodidei o dieqnhs paragontas.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Qewreite katakthsh thn ypoxwrhsh gia toys S-300 h thn paradosh toy Otsalan; Ta qewreite katakthsh ayta;

NIKOLAOY: Den exw antirrhsh na mpw se ayth th syzhthsh, alla ayta einai qemata poy exoyn syzhthqei kai exoyn doqei oi katallhles apanthseis.

STAMATOPOYLOS: Epeidh milhsate gia katakthseis.

NIKOLAOY: H Ellada, pantws, proxwra. Mporei se orismenoys na mhn aresei ayto, enw qa eprepe, giati otan proxwra h Ellada proxwrame oloi mas. Se orismenoys den aresei. Se peisma, loipon, oswn den aresei h Ellada proxwraei kai qa proxwraei.

STAMATOPOYLOS:..kai ypoxwrei...

NIKOLAOY: Proxwrei.

FILHS: Eipate ayto gia thn protash toy k. Alabanoy. Ean oi eyrwboyleytes kai oi boyleytes epixeirhsoyn na poreyqoyn, isxyei -opws eipate- o nomos gia oloys toys polites, ara isxyei kai gi aytoys. H astynomikh apagoreysh exei mia sygkekrimenh aitiologia. Milaei gia to fobo na proklhqei blabh, problhmata sth dhmosia asfaleia. Pisteyete oti oi eyrwboyleytes kai oi boyleytes einai ypoptoi epeisodiwn kai gi ayto den qelete na kanoyn aytoi mia symbolikh poreia, gia na epidwsoyn to chfisma mias laikhs kinhtopoihshs;

NIKOLAOY: Kat arxhn emeis den eipame pws den qeloyme, na kanei kapoios mia symbolikh poreia. Den apanthsa se kati tetoio. Oydeis eqese thn erwthsh kai egw den apanthsa kati tetoio. Ayto poy eipa einai, oti yparxoyn oi dedomenes apofaseis, yparxei h eyqynh mas na diasfalisoyme to kyros ths xwras kai apo thn allh meria yparxoyn diafores mikropolitikes idees -kai elpizw oxi kai praktikes, qa to deijei omws h istoria twn epomenwn hmerwn- me tis opoies kapoioi sth xwra mas prospaqoyn, eite na epibebaiwsoyn thn yparjh toys, eite na dhmioyrghsoyn problhmata sthn kybernhsh. Ayto to antimetwpizoyme me sygkekrimeno tropo. Gi ayto kai eipa, sthn arxh ths shmerinhs mas syzhthshs, oti kapoioi asxoloyntai me th mikropolitikh, h kybernhsh asxoleitai me thn politikh kai ta symferonta ths xwras. Oi asxoloymenoi me mikropolitikh, as synexisoyn na to kanoyn. Ektiqentai oi idioi.

FILHS: To erwthma einai, an h kybernhsh, dia ths Astynomias, qa epixeirhsei na parempodisei mia tetoia symbolikh poreia boyleytwn kai eyrwboyleytwn, opws exei ejaggelqei, oti exoyn proqesh merikoi na kanoyn.

NIKOLAOY: Apanthsa oloklhrwmena kai safws, oti yparxoyn polloi tropoi gia na katadeijei kaneis thn aneyqynothta toy. Qa perimenoyme na doyme mexri poy qa fqasei h aneyqynothta. H kybernhsh deixnei thn ypeyqynothta ths.

FILHS: H syllhch epaytofwrw boyleytwn h eyrwboyleytwn symfwna me toys nomoys...

NIKOLAOY: Fqanete poly makria. Epitrecete moy na pw oti dhmioyrgeite senaria episthmonikhs fantasias. Ftasame sthn ejelijh enos senarioy kai sto telos toy, enw akoma den exei arxisei. Den syzhtoyme epi ypoqetikwn senariwn. Apo apoch politikhs syzhtame kai sas lew poia einai h politikh ths kybernhshs.

FILHS: Kapoioi exoyn ejaggeilei, kai einai boyleytes kai eyrwboyleytes, thn proqesh toys na pragmatopoihsoyn poreia kai na epidwsoyn to chfisma...

NIKOLAOY: Den exw akoysei kanena na exei ejaggeilei kati tetoio. Ap oti me plhroforhsan oi synadelfoi sas ligo prin, o k. Alabanos exei kanei kapoies tetoies dhlwseis.

FILHS: Rwtw, loipon, an telika aytoi poy to ejhggeilan proxwrhsoyn sthn ylopoihsh ayths ths ejaggelias, eseis qa toys parempodisete kai qa toys syllabete;

NIKOLAOY: Apanthsa kai epanalambanw: H aneyqynothta mporei na ylopoieitai me polloys tropoys. Qa anamenoyme ki emeis kai o mesos Ellhnas poliths na doyme mexri poy mporei na fqasei h aneyqynothta kapoiwn.

FILHS: Sxetika me to qema ths enhmerwshs. Yparxei kati neotero;

NIKOLAOY: Akoma den exoyme katalhjei, isxyei ayto poy eipa xqes. Prospaqoyme na dieyrynoyme oso perissotero ton ariqmo gia na mporoyn na kalyfqoyn oloi. Shmera to apogeyma qa exoyme perissoteres plhrofories.

FILHS: Sxetika me to entono diabhma ths ESHEA kai thn protash na symmetexoyn oloi oi diapisteymenoi dhmosiografoi, ti apantate;

NIKOLAOY: Makari na mporoyme na to ikanopoihsoyme. Milhsa me ton k. Kiao, toy ejhghsa pws exoyn ta qemata. Bebaiws, h ESHEA exei tis apoceis ths kai einai sebastes. Qa prospaqhsoyme na kanoyme to kalytero dynato.

FILHS: Pote qa exoyme thn apanthsh;

NIKOLAOY: To apogeyma.

Sas eyxaristw.

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