Greek Government Press Briefing, 98-10-26

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From: The Hellenic Ministry of Press & Mass Media <http://www.minpress.gr/>

YPOYRGEIO TYPOY & MESWN MAZIKHS ENHMERWSHS

Aqhna, 26 Oktwbrioy 1998

H ENHMERWSH TWN POLITIKWN SYNTAKTWN KAI TWN ANTAPOKRITWN JENOY TYPOY APO TON YPOYRGO TYPOY & MESWN MAZIKHS ENHMERWSHS KAI KYBERNHTIKO EKPROSWPO DHMHTRH REPPA

Geia sas kai kalh ebdomada.

Opws gnwrizete o Prwqypoyrgos brisketai sto Agion Oros, ap` opoy qa epistrecei to apogeyma. Thn Paraskeyh qa synedriasei h Kybernhtikh Epitroph.

Akoyw tis erwthseis sas.

KONTOPOYLOS: O Prwqypoyrgos me thn epistrofh toy, mhpws elabe tis apofaseis tis opoies yposxeqhke oti qa labei; Dioti shmera yparxoyn polles synenteyjeis koryfaiwn stelexwn toy PASOK, poy miloyn gia thn anagkh allagwn, eite domikwn, eite se epipedo proswpwn ths Kybernhshs.

REPPAS: Gnwrizete poia einai h qesh mas. Sto qema ayto den exei allajei o, tidhpote apo ayta ta opoia gnwrizete kai prepei na meinete s` ayto.

KONTOPOYLOS: Pws sxoliazete, omws, to gegonos oti koryfaia stelexh lene dhmosia kai zhtoyn apo ton Prwqypoyrgo na proxwrhsei se allages;

REPPAS: Den einai h prwth fora poy ta stelexh miloyn dhmosiws kai ekfrazoyn tis apoceis toys kai den qa einai kai h teleytaia. Ayto einai ena stoixeio ths dhmokratikhs leitoyrgias ths Kybernhshs kai toy Kinhmatos mas.

KIAOS: Ti den exei allajei;

REPPAS: Gia to qema ayto exw, kat` epanalhch, apanthsei.

KIAOS: Mporeite na epanalabete thn apanthsh;

REPPAS: Oti den yfistatai tetoio qema, den mas apasxolei tetoio qema.

KIAOS: O anasxhmatismos, dhladh;

REPPAS: Ayto einai to qema poy eqese o k. Kontopoylos.

MIXAHL: Ola ta koryfaia stelexh proteinoyn anasxhmatismo. Ti exei na mas pei h Kybernhsh;

REPPAS: Apanthsa prin. H qesh mas paramenei ayth poy gnwrizete.

MIXAHL: O Prwqypoyrgos kateqese sto Pertsax ena ypomnhma sto opoio leei, meses akres, oti h Eyrwph prepei na apokthsei thn arxh ths koinwnikhs allhleggyhs k. lp., k. lp.. Giati, o Prwqypoyrgos ayto to ypomnhma den to efarmozei sthn Ellada;

REPPAS: Gnwrizw th dhlwsh poy ekane o k. Kwnstantopoylos kai sto pneyma ayto einai kai h dikh sas erwthsh. Ayth einai h politikh h opoia efarmozetai sthn Ellada kai o Prwqypoyrgos sthn prospaqeia poy kataballei, ws epikefalhs ths Kybernhshs, gia thn entajh ths xwras sthn ONE niwqei apolyta thn eyqynh poy exei na odhghsei oloklhrh thn Ellada kai olo ton ellhniko lao s` ayth th nea eyrwpaikh pragmatikothta. Giati, h entajh ths xwras sthn ONE synepagetai, metajy twn allwn, th diasfalish twn dikaiwmatwn twn Ellhnwn politwn, twn ergazomenwn, twn laikwn strwmatwn. H prospaqeia ayth poy kanei h Kybernhsh pisteyoyme oti exei eqniko xarakthra, opws kat` epanalhch exoyme pei. Pisteyoyme oti einai mia prospaqeia, h opoia telika qa stefqei me apolyth epityxia. Emeis -kai ayto problepetai sthn politikh poy akoloyqei h Kybernhsh- epiqymoyme na antistaqmisoyme, me metra koinwnikhs politikhs, tis apwleies poy yfistantai diafores omades toy plhqysmoy, sthn prospaqeia ayth poy kanoyme, logw ths askoymenhs politikhs. Sto pneyma ayto einai diatypwmenh kai h protash, to mnhmonio poy kateqese o Prwqypoyrgos, sthn prosfath Synodo Koryfhs. Metajy twn allwn, tonizetai kai h anagkh h Eyrwph na anadeijei to eyrwpaiko orama, to orama toy mellontos twn eyrwpaikwn koinwniwn, ws koinwniwn poy qa diathrhsoyn ton anqrwpokentriko xarakthra toys, prokeimenoy etsi -sthn prospaqeia ayth ths eyrwpaikhs enopoihshs, poy exei apokthsei mia dynamikh, mia ayjhmenh taxythta- na symmetexoyn olo kai perissotero oi polites twn xwrwn-melwn ths E. E.. Ayth einai h politikh poy askeitai kai to mnhmonio poy kateqese o Prwqypoyrgos brisketai se eyqeia grammh me thn askoymenh sto eswteriko ths xwras mas politikh.

MIXAHL: Kyrie Ypoyrge, epeidh akribws brisketai se "eyqeia grammh", opws mas eipate, ayth h grammh threitai apo kapoioys sygkekrimenoys ypoyrgoys. Erxontai, omws, alloi koryfaioi paragontes toy PASOK kai ths Kybernhshs kai zhtoyn na allajoyn proswpa poy isws leitoyrghsoyn kalytera. Giati, loipon, ayto to endexomeno den ejetazetai apo ton Prwqypoyrgo;

REPPAS: Kaqe stelexos exei tis dikes toy apoceis. Omws, o Prwqypoyrgos einai ekeinos, o opoios qa labei tis apofaseis, opws problepetai apo to Syntagma toy kratoys. To qema ayto, loipon, einai apokleistiko dikaiwma kai armodiothta toy Prwqypoyrgoy. Oloi exoyn dikaiwma na ekfrazoyn tis apoceis toys. Kai, qa elega, oti ayth h eleyqerh ekfrash twn apocewn ypagetai sthn prospaqeia poy kanoyme oloi, prokeimenoy na exoyme ta kalytera dynata apotelesmata, mesw ths synergasias mas sthn Kybernhsh, alla kai sto PASOK.

MPOYATAR: Qelw na sas rwthsw gia ta dyo aeroplana F-16 poy briskontai sthn Kypro, an yparxei symfwnia me thn Kypro na parameinoyn sthn Pafo kai an nai pote problepetai na ginei kati tetoio;

REPPAS: Ta ellhnika maxhtika aeroskafh, epeidh anhkoyn sthn Ellhnikh Polemikh Aeroporia, exoyn bash to ellhniko edafos. Apo ekei kai pera, sto plaisio toy Dogmatos toy Eniaioy Amyntikoy Xwroy, qa ginetai xrhsh kai ajiopoihsh enoplwn dynamewn mas, prokeimenoy na dwsoyme nohma kai periexomeno sto Dogma ayto kai na symbaloyme etsi sthn enisxysh ths amynas ths Kyproy, pragma to opoio einai apolytws aparaithto, kai thn peraiterw diasfalish twn synqhkwn staqerothtas sthn eyryterh perioxh.

ALEJAKH: H efhmerida "AQHNAtKH" exei shmera ena qema, to opoio anaferei ta ejhs: Oti yparxei mia Ekqesh toy Dieqnoys Nomismatikoy Tameioy poy proeidopoiei thn Ellada oti den qa kataferei na mpei oyte to 2001 sthn ONE. Kai malista anaferei sygkekrimena oti o plhqwrismos einai to megalo problhma. Qelw to sxolio sas. Kai mia deyterh erwthsh: Ayth thn Ekqesh thn eidame prin apo liges hmeres emeis, plhn omws eleipe ayth h selida apo thn Ekqesh poy edeixne oti proeidopoiei thn Ellada gia tis dyskolies na ftasei sthn ONE to 2001. Gnwrizete kati gi` ayto; Exete na peite kati gi` ayto;

REPPAS: Qelete na moy peite se poia periodo anafereste; Pote egine ayth h Ekqesh;

ALEJAKH: Prokeitai gia thn teleytaia Ekqesh, h opoia htan prin apo 15 ews 20 hmeres peripoy, an den me apata h mnhmh moy. Pantws mesa sto mhna ayto htan h Ekqesh toy DNT.

REPPAS: Htan to mhna ayto;

ALEJAKH: Nai. Kai dhmosieyqhke stis efhmerides kapoio keimeno poy elege...

REPPAS: Ekproswpoi toy Dieqnoys Nomismatikoy Tameioy episkefqhkan thn Ellada ton perasmeno Maio. Sthn Ekqesh toys diatypwsan, metajy twn allwn, problhmatismoys kai gia to megeqos toy plhqwrismoy. Bebaiws, xwris thn analhch kapoiwn prwtoboyliwn, xwris th lhch sygkekrimenwn metrwn sta opoia exoyme proxwrhsei -kai anaferomai sth meiwsh emmeswn forwn- mporoyse kapoios na problecei oti o plhqwrismos qa kymainotan s` ayta ta epipeda. Apo tote omws, exei perasei arketos kairos kai polla exoyn allajei. Exoyn analhfqei aytes oi prwtoboylies. Exoyme mia peraiterw apoklimakwsh toy plhqwrismoy. Kai einai bebaio oti qa epityxoyme telika kai ayto to stoxo. Ara qa ikanopoihsoyme ola ta krithria, gia na entaxqoyme, apo thn arxh toy 2000 sthn ONE. Exoyme ypoch mas ayth thn Ekqesh toy DNT toy perasmenoy Maioy. Den yparxei allh Ekqesh. Toylaxiston den exei perielqei se gnwsh mas opoiadhpote allh Ekqesh kai den mporei na yparxei allh. H Ekqesh toy DNT einai sth diaqesh mas apo thn 21h Maioy. Exei ginei anafora sthn Ekqesh ayth, mesw dhmosieymatwn pollwn efhmeridwn ekeinhs ths periodoy. Ta exw sth diaqesh sas. Ayto poy mporw na sas pw -giati ta stoixeia ayta kykloforoyn, einai diaqesima- einai toyto: Yparxei h prosfath Ekqesh ths Eyrwpaikhs Epitrophs, poy problepei oti h Ellada qa entaxqei kanonika sthn ONE, me bash to xronodiagramma poy exoyme qesei. Sto qema ayto anaferqhkan oi efhmerides ths 22as Oktwbrioy, liges hmeres prin dhladh, para to oti moy dinete thn eykairia na pw oti sto qema ayto oi efhmerides anaferqhkan me enan tropo poy deixnei, apo toys titloys toylaxiston, oti kaqe mia antilambanetai diaforetika thn enhmerwsh. Kai epishs, pera apo ayth thn ekqesh ths Komision, h opoia einai poly apokalyptikh, yparxei mia pio prosfath (apo tis 23 Oktwbrioy) ekqesh mias etairias h opoia probainei se egkyres ektimhseis, mias megalhs Trapezas, ths MORGAN STANLEY, poy problepei oti h Ellada qa epityxei apolytws toys stoxoys ths. Oson afora ton plhqwrismo, problepei gia to telos toy 1999 ena pososto 2,4%, poy gnwrizete poly kala oti einai entos twn stoxwn poy exoyme qesei. Me ayth thn ennoia, pisteyoyme oti qa epityxoyme s` ayth thn prospaqeia poy kanoyme. Oi probleceis apo toys egkyroys Organismoys einai eyoiwnes, qetikes. Einai symfwnes me tis ektimhseis poy kanoyme ki emeis sto eswteriko ths xwras. Allo qema den gnwrizw na yparxei.

FASOYLAS: Kyrie Ekproswpe, thn apoch poy diatypwnei shmera o Proedros ths Boylhs sta "NEA" oti h sygkroysh me thn Toyrkia einai anapofeykth, thn yioqeteite;

REPPAS: Gnwrizete kala oti h ejwterikh politikh poy askoyme einai politikh eirhnhs, filias kai synergasias me oles tis xwres ths perioxhs. Qa moy epitrecete, na epanalabw mia frash poy xrhsimopoiw kat` epanalhch kai exei th shmasia ths: "an den mporeis na kaneis toys filoys soy geitones, prepei na prospaqhseis na kaneis toys geitones soy, filoys". Alla bebaiws, h filia kai h kalh geitonia yparxoyn, otan ypakoyoyn se sygkekrimenoys kanones. Otan ekplhrwnontai sygkekrimenes proypoqeseis kai oroi, opws einai h apofygh proklhtikwn kai epiqetikwn energeiwn. Se ayth thn kateyqynsh kinoymaste sto plaisio ths ejwterikhs politikhs mas. Makari, na synebaine to idio kai apo thn allh pleyra. Den symbainei ayto shmera kai gi` ayto synthreitai h entash stis sxeseis twn dyo xwrwn, me kindynoys gia thn asfaleia sthn eyryterh perioxh. Pisteyoyme oti den qa odhghqoyme se mia krish aytoy toy megeqoys, wste na milhsoyme pleon gia qermh anametrhsh. Ayto einai kati poy pisteyw den epiqymei opoiosdhpote logikos, synetos anqrwpos, epeidh akribws h isorropia sthn perioxh einai eyqraysth kai oloi lambanoyn metra, prokeimenoy na apofygoyme ta xeirotera. Alla bebaiws, ayth h synthroymenh entash stis sxeseis twn dyo xwrwn, einai enas para poly arnhtikos paragontas gia tis synqhkes poy epikratoyn sthn perioxh.

G. KAMPOYRAKHS: Ayth thn wra, sto grafeio toy Genikoy Grammatea toy Ypoyrgikoy Symboylioy, toy k. Kosmidh, briskontai o Ypoyrgos Dhmosias Tajhs k. Rwmaios kai o neos Arxhgos ths Ellhnikhs Astynomias k. Papadogiannakhs. Gnwrizete toys logoys ayths ths synanthshs;

REPPAS: Oxi, den gnwrizw toys logoys ayths ths synanthshs.

KIAOS: Gi` ayto akribws qelw na sas rwthsw: Pws antimetwpizei h Kybernhsh thn katastash sthn Ellhnikh Astynomia, meta thn odo Niobhs, meta ton periergo qanato toy Matei Sorin, ta prosfata gegonota, meta th dolofonia, dioti kata thn Eisaggelea Qessalonikhs to atyxhma, poy mas eipate ki eseis toy makarith toy mikroy toy Serboy, einai egklhma ek proqesews. Etsi leei h ka Eisaggeleys. Meta thn aytoktonia toy nearoy, toy pitsirika, toy 14xronoy, sto Astynomiko Tmhma sth Drama. Meta apo ola ayta erxontai kyklwmata astynomikwn poy ekmetalleyontai gynaikes, porneia dhladh kanoyn. Meta apo ayta exoyme ena swro pragmata. Pws ta antimetwpizete eseis;

REPPAS: Ola ayta ta tragika fainomena, ta opoia ekdhlwnontai kai sthn ellhnikh koinwnia, mporei na pei kaneis oti apoteloyn thn idia pleyra toy nomismatos poy kykloforei sthn eyrwpaikh koinwnia, se olo ton kosmo, sthn epoxh mas. Ayjhsh ths egklhmatikothtas...

ALEJAKH: Milame gia thn egklhmatikothta ths Astynomias...

REPPAS:... fainomena ta opoia den exoyn kamia sxesh me th fysiologikh leitoyrgia mias koinwnias anqrwpwn. H Ellhnikh Astynomia, gnwrizete poly kala oti prospaqei na exei apotelesma sthn antimetwpish twn egklhmatwn. Den to epitygxanei panta. Qa einai adiko na mhn pistwsoyme sta qetika ths Ellhnikhs Astynomias tis epityxies poy kata kairoys exei epideijei, xwris ayto na shmainei oti arnoymai kai tis astoxies kai tis apotyxies ths. O sygkekrimenos astyfylakas eteqh se diaqesimothta. Prepei, omws, na pw oti den exei shmasia na antimetwpizoyme, ek twn ysterwn, mesw dikastikwn ereynwn h me energeies kai prwtoboylies ths Dioikhshs tetoioy eidoys peristatika. Shmasia exei na ta prolambanoyme. Ayto shmainei oti h Astynomia prepei na enisxyqei akomh perissotero me sygxrono ejoplismo, alla kai me beltiwsh toy epipedoy ekpaideyshs twn andrwn ths. Kai bebaiws, h hgesia ths EL. AS kai toy Ypoyrgeioy Dhmosias Tajhs kataballoyn megalh prospaqeia gia na exoyme ta epiqymhta apotelesmata ston tomea ths ejygianshs toy xwroy ths Ellhnikhs Astynomias. Den exoyme ta epiqymhta apotelesmata. Prepei na synexisoyme, loipon, ayth thn prospaqeia, h opoia antilambaneste ki eseis pws kaqe allo, para eykolh einai. H Ellada einai mia xwra h opoia einai ekteqeimenh logw ths gewgrafikhs qeshs mas. Qa prepei na katabaloyme megalh prospaqeia, wste na ejaleifqoyn ta fainomena ayta. Kai fainetai pws den einai eykolo na to epityxoyme ayto, prin perasei arketos kairos h prin symboyn polles akomh allages sto eswteriko ths Astynomias, wste na ginei pio apotelesmatikh.

KIAOS: Sas rwthsa gia sygkekrimena pragmata poy symbainoyn sto xwro ths Ellhnikhs Astynomias me qymata synexws aqwa paidia, polites me ekmetalleyseis poy kanoyn oi idioi oi astynomikoi, me, me, me... ena swro pragmata kai to syndesate -kai den katalaba pws- me to ejwteriko.

MPOYATAR: Kai h apanthsh ths Kybernhshs apo dw kai empros, qa einai synexeia, otan milame gia ta problhmata ths Astynomias, na mas leei oti to problhma erxetai apo to ejwteriko kai apo thn eisagomenh egklhmatikothta... ;

REPPAS: Prepei na sas pw oti to qema ths egklhmatikothtas to qetoyn polloi hgetes. Eteqh kai sthn prosfath Ektakth Synodo Koryfhs. Oi hgetes poy elaban to logo, tonisan metajy allwn, oti dipla sto problhma ths anergias ena terastio problhma poy exei to idio baros gia tis prospaqeies twn Kybernhsewn, einai h ayjhsh ths egklhmatikothtas. H ayjhsh ths egklhmatikothtas einai ena dieqnes fainomeno. Den apantatai mono sthn Ellada. Oson afora twra th dikh mas xwra, eipa oti den arkei ek twn ysterwn, afoy exoyme qymata, na antimetwpizoyme tis synepeies aytwn twn tragikwn fainomenwn, eite me prwtoboylies twn dikastwn, eite me energeies ths Dioikhshs. Qa prepei na prolambanoyme ayta ta fainomena. Mporoyme na ta prolaboyme, an h ejygiansh sto xwro ths Astynomias proxwrhsei akomh perissotero. Pragma poy fainetai oti einai anagkaio, efoson beltiwqei to epipedo ekpaideyshs twn astynomikwn kai bebaiws, efoson h EL. AS. apokthsei to sygxrono ejoplismo poy xreiazetai gia na synexisei to ergo ths. Milhsa gi` ayta prin. Ta eipa.

ALEJAKH: S' olo ton kosmo, se oles tis Astynomies toy kosmoy -kai sthn EL. AS. - yparxoyn kroysmata diafqoras. Sthn Amerikh, sthn Eyrwph, sthn Agglia kai sthn Italia poly perissotera. Endexomenws ayta ta kroysmata na einai memonwmena. Edw exoyme mia katastash, h opoia an mh ti allo, problhmatizei oloys toys polites. Exoyme thn Ellhnikh Astynomia na einai mexri to "laimo" mesa se tetoies istories. Para polla melh ths. Den einai enas, den einai dyo. Kaqe mera akoyme gia kyklwmata, gia astynomikoys poy mperdeyontai eite se narkwtika, eite me gynaikes, eite me o, tidhpote allo. Ti mporei na ginei me ayto to pragma; Qa perimenoyme wspoy na beltiwqoyn oi synqhkes; Den ginetai na yparjei kapoios allos tropos;

REPPAS: Den yparxei allos tropos. Oi dromoi toys opoioys prepei na akoloyqhsoyme einai aytoi toys opoioys anefera prin: Ejygiansh, kalyterh ekpaideysh, ypobohqhsh toy ergoy ths Astynomias me ton katallhlo ejoplismo. Apo kei kai pera, gnwrizete poly kala, oti h Kybernhsh, me ton Ypoyrgo Dhmosias Tajhs, anelabe thn prwtoboylia kai isxyei, pleon, ena nomiko plaisio gia ton elegxo aytwn twn fainomenwn, poly diaforetiko apo ayto poy isxye sto parelqon. Den apotelei eswterikh ypoqesh ths Astynomias o elegxos kai h apodosh eyqynwn. Epilambanontai, pleon, Eisaggeleis, dikastika organa, prokeimenoy h diadikasia ayth ereynas kai apodoshs eyqynwn na einai antikeimenikh kai na mh qewreitai oti ejantloymenh, sto eswteriko ths Astynomias, mia tetoia ereyna, exei para polla stoixeia merolhcias h sygkalychs eyqynwn synadelfwn. Ara, loipon, pisteyw oti oloi symfwnoyme sthn kateyqynsh ayth poy kineitai h Kybernhsh. Na yparxei, dhladh, elegxos gia ta diadramatizomena sthn EL. AS. apo organa ektos ths EL. AS. Ayto einai ena metro, to opoio ypagetai sthn kathgoria twn prwtoboyliwn gia thn ejygiansh ths EL. AS.

MIXAHL: Apo th stigmh poy h Kybernhsh exei arxisei na kanei ayta poy lete, dyo xronia kai kati twra, kai den exei apotelesma, den ferei kaneis eyqynh; Giati na mhn yparxei apotelesma ayth th dietia kai poios einai aytos poy elegxei aytoys oi opoioi efarmozoyn tetoia metra, an einai apotelesmatika h oxi;

REPPAS: H Kybernhsh einai ayth poy, kat' ejoxhn, exei eyqynh gia thn politikh poy askei, ara kai gia ta apotelesmata ayths ths politikhs. Se polloys tomeis exoyme qeamatika, qetika apotelesmata, se alloys tomeis exoyme shmantikh proodo, alla, bebaiws, ta apotelesmata ypoleipontai twn prosdokiwn mas. Qa synexisoyme thn prospaqeia mas. Parakaloyme ki eseis na krinete to ergo mas, me dedomeno to problhma, to opoio yparxei sth xwra mas h lambanontas yp och tis nees synqhkes poy dhmioyrgoyntai, pleon, sto dieqnh xwro, alla kai sthn Ellada, logw toy megaloy kymatos twn oikonomikwn prosfygwn, alla kai logw ths nootropias poy fainetai oti exei eisbalei, se megalo baqmo, se polloys elegktikoys mhxanismoys kai sthn EL. AS. Mia xalarwsh, dhladh, ths syneidhshs xreoys kai kaqhkontos, pragma to opoio polles fores odhgei sthn anapotelesmatikh antimetwpish aytwn twn fainomenwn.

MIXAHL: Lete oti h Kybernhsh efarmozei mia politikh, den eiste eyxaristhmenoi apo ayth kai par' ola ayta qa synexistei. Synhqws, h logikh leei oti otan kapoios kanei kati kai den einai apodotiko, koita na to diorqwsei, na to enisxysei, na kanei kati diaforetiko, na to prosarmosei, telos pantwn, na dhmioyrghsei mia nea katastash. Ayth den th blepoyme, oyte sto qema twn proswpwn, oyte se kati kainoyrgio se mia nea politikh. Tipota den blepoyme apo ayta. Blepoyme, loipon, mia prospaqeia, h opoia -anagnwrizete ki eseis- den exei ferei mexri twra apotelesmata -ta epiqymhta opws lete- kai synexizete thn idia politikh, thn idia prospaqeia. Giati;

REPPAS: Prwta ap' ola to symperasma poy bgalate kai qesate sthn erwthsh sas einai diko sas, den einai diko moy. Eipate eseis, oti lew pws h Kybernhsh den einai ikanopoihmenh. Den sas eipa egw kati tetoio.

MIXAHL: Eseis mas to eipate twra.

REPPAS: Eipa oti exoyme shmantikh proodo se polloys tomeis, alla syxna, ta apotelesmata ypoleipontai twn prosdokiwn mas se kapoioys tomeis. Ayto de shmainei oti den exoyme na paroysiasoyme qetiko ergo. Isa-isa h diapistwsh ayth deixnei afenos, oti miloyme me tolmh kai eilikrineia kai afeteroy oti qa prepei na synexisoyme thn prospaqeia mas, wste kai stoys tomeis aytoys, oloklhrwnontas to ergo mas, na epityxoyme toys stoxoys poy exoyme qesei. Na exoyme qetika apotelesmata. Einai kati to opoio sas parakalw na to krinete ejetazontas ta pragmata sth diarkeia toy xronoy. Oxi apo memonwmena peristatika. Xreos ths Kybernhshs mas, to anagnwrizoyme ayto, einai na dhmioyrghsei synqhkes stis opoies o poliths qa zei kai qa noiwqei asfalhs kai sigoyros.

SEtSOBA: Qa analabei h Ellada ta ejoda ths khdeias toy Marko Mpoylatobits, poy skotwqhke sth Qessalonikh; Grafthke oti qa ta analabei h EL. AS.

REPPAS: Gia to qema ayto oi armodies yphresies exoyn probei se synennohseis. Pisteyoyme oti efoson, texnika h qesmika, einai epitrepto kai efikto, mporoyme na to kanoyme. Kai ekfrazoyme gia mia akomh fora th lyph mas gia to tragiko ayto symban.

KIAOS: Mia dieykrinish an moy epitrepete, se ayto poy eipate. Milhsate prohgoymenws gia "astoxies kai apotyxies ths EL. AS". Entassete mesa stis astoxies ta dyo teleytaia peristatika me toys anhlikoys sth Qessalonikh kai th Drama;

REPPAS: Gia to symban me ton atyxo Gioygkoslabo, teqhke amesws se diaqesimothta o astyfylakas kai diataxqhke amesws ereyna. Apo thn ereyna ayth an fanei oti exei eyqynh o sygkekrimenos astynomikos, h eyqynh qa toy apodoqei kai tote antilambaneste pws qa exoyme ena klassiko paradeigma, mia periptwsh apotyxias h astoxias. An apodeixqei -den exei oloklhrwqei h ereyna kai den mporw na to pw twra- oti den edrase orqa o astynomikos, antilambaneste pws ayto mporei na odhghsei sto symperasma oti eixame mia astoxia, mia apotyxia.

KIAOS: Kai gia to peristatiko ths Dramas, toy 14xronoy poy kremasthke mesa sto astynomiko tmhma;

REPPAS: Gi ayta diejagetai ereyna. Prin oloklhrwqei h ereyna mhn perimenete na ekdwsw egw porisma.

KIAOS: Eixate pei, se prohgoymenh enhmerwsh, oti h ekpaideysh einai doyleia, apokleistika kai mono, ths hgesias ths EL. AS. Epimenete s' ayto;

REPPAS: Asfalws.

KIAOS: Kai kati akomh. Me to porisma, gia tis synqhkes krathsews kai qanatoy toy Sorin Matei, pote qa teleiwsei kai pote qa doqei sth dhmosiothta;

REPPAS: Einai kati gia to opoio oi idioi oi eisaggelikoi leitoyrgoi, oi anakrites poy exoyn epilhfqei, qa apofasisoyn, efoson, bebaiws, krinoyn oti einai plhrhs h ereyna poy exoyn analabei na kanoyn. To xrono ths ereynas den ton prosdiorizoyme emeis.

KIAOS: Ara, me ayto to teleytaio poy lete, isxyei h plhroforia poy metadidetai, pws arxizei apo thn arxh h ereyna kat' entolh ths Eisaggelias toy Areioy Pagoy;

REPPAS: Sta eswterika ths Dikaiosynhs, sta ths anaqeshs kaqhkontwn gia sygkekrimeno ergo se dikastikoys leitoyrgoys, den qa ypeiselqei h Kybernhsh, giati apoteloyn qemata me ta opoia asxoleitai h Dikaiosynh, xwris ejwterikoys ephreasmoys.

KYRIAKIDOY: Den exw katalabei pws syndeetai to "eisagomeno" egklhma, me to qanato enos jenoy toyrista sth Qessalonikh. Yparxei kapoia kainoyrgia statistikh poy na deixnei oti yparxei ayth h ayjhsh apo jenoys egklhmaties; H teleytaia poy exei dwsei o k. Rwmaios den edeixne kati tetoio. Kai, epishs, gia to qema ths ejygianshs, ti sygkekrimena metra pairnete, pleon toy na epembainei, meta to gegonos, kapoia Eisaggelikh Arxh gia na kanei mia ereyna;

REPPAS: Milhsa genikws gia to qema ths egklhmatikothtas, ws ena fainomeno poy apasxolei tis kybernhseis se olh thn Eyrwph. Den synedesa to sygkekrimeno peristatiko, oyte anefera ton atyxo Serbo, san paradeigma oikonomikoy prosfyga. Kaqe allo. Einai kati poy den to gnwrizw kai den moy epitrepetai na to kanw. Apo kei kai pera oi prospaqeies, oi opoies ginontai apo thn EL. AS. einai gnwstes, anaferqhka s' aytes. Ta apotelesmata qa ta krinete eseis.

KYRIAKIDOY: Pantws, kainoyrgia statistikh den yparxei h yparxei kai den thn gnwrizoyme;

REPPAS: Gia to qema ayto exei ginei pollh syzhthsh. Prepei na sas pw oti to dexontai oloi, oxi mono sthn Ellada, alla kai dieqnws, oti o paragontas aytos exei thn epidrash toy. Mhn to parablepete. Mhn prospaqeite na odhghsete ta pragmata sth mia akrh, prokeimenoy na bgaloyme ena symperasma. Opws den einai swsto na pame sthn allh akrh, oti gia thn egklhmatikothta ftaine oi oikonomikoi prosfyges. Apo thn allh, omws, mhn poyme oti gia to fainomeno ths egklhmatikothtas den exoyn kamia epidrash oi oikonomikoi prosfyges, poy se megalo pososto prosfeygoyn se diafores xwres -kai sth dikh mas- anazhtwntas mia kalyterh tyxh.

MPOYATAR: Emeis milhsame gia thn astynomikh egklhmatikothta. Eseis ferate to qema twn oikonomikwn prosfygwn, gi ayto rwtw an yparxei kapoia sxesh.

REPPAS: Milhsa gia to fainomeno ths egklhmatikothtas. Oson afora th drash ths Astynomias th sxoliasame, milhsame gia ta qetika kai tis epityxies ths, anagnwrisame tis astoxies kai tis apotyxies ths. Parakalw, omws, na bgazete teliko symperasma, apo to synoliko ergo ths Astynomias. Giati, bebaiws, mia arnhtikh ejelijh einai ayth h opoia dhmioyrgei kai tis entypwseis. Kai einai poly eykolo na aixmalwtisei, me th dhmioyrgia aytwn twn entypwsewn, thn krish kai thn antilhch aytoy, o opoios kaleitai na bgalei symperasma. Para to oti, bebaiws, den epitrepontai tetoia fainomena kai qa prepei na ejaleifqoyn, prepei na sas pw oti se olo ton kosmo -gnwrizete para polles istories ki eseis- exoyme tetoioy eidoys ejelijeis. Qa prepei na tis antimetwpisoyme.

SOYRMELIDHS: H Kybernhsh qewrei oti h Astynomia einai ayth th stigmh etoimh kai ikanh na antimetwpisei ayta ta nea fainomena kai tis nees synqhkes poy dhmioyrgoyntai;

REPPAS: Gia na exoyme aytes tis astoxies gia tis opoies milhsa, shmainei oti h Astynomia ypoleipetai toy epipedoy sto opoio qeloyme na brisketai. Ginetai, loipon, prospaqeia na beltiwqei to epipedo kai h prospaqeia ayth einai synexhs. Para thn opoia proodo, pote den mporei kapoios na ekfrasei ikanopoihsh oti petyxe to aristo apotelesma, giati panta yparxoyn periqwria beltiwshs. H prospaqeia synexizetai.

KIAOS: Mporei na einai synaisqhmatikh h erwthsh, alla, zhthse kaneis apo thn Kybernhsh -pera apo thn ekfrash lyphs- sygnwmh apo toys goneis toy Serboy kai toy Boylgaroy pitsirika; Sygnwmh, oxi lyph.

REPPAS: Den to gnwrizw ayto. Nomizw oti h epikoinwnia poy eixe h ellhnikh Kybernhsh me tis arxes ths Gioygkoslabias kai malista se ychlo epipedo, metajy twn allwn, exei kai tetoia stoixeia. Den mporw na metaferw akribws tis lejeis poy xrhsimopoihqhkan. Mporw na sas pw, omws, oti exoyme apolyth synaisqhsh ths tragikothtas toy gegonotos kai gi ayto akribws to antimetwpizoyme me th deoysa sobarothta.

Sas eyxaristw poly.

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