Greek Government Press Briefing, 09-04-14

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From: The Hellenic Ministry of Press & Mass Media <http://www.minpress.gr/>

Tmhma Dhmosiografikwn Kalycewn

Trith, 14 Aprilioy 2009

Ariqmos Deltioy: 196615529

Ekdosh 1

brf14042009

O KYBERNHTIKOS EKPROSWPOS

Aqhna, 14 Aprilioy 2009

EYAGGELO ANTWNARO

Geia sas.

" Oloklhrwqhke prin apo ligo, ypo thn proedria toy Prwqypoyrgoy k. Kwsta Karamanlh, sto Megaro Majimoy, h synedriash ths Diypoyrgikhs Epitrophs Oikonomikhs Politikhs, me th symmetoxh kai ths Ypoyrgoy Apasxolhshs kai Koinwnikhs Prostasias k. Fanhs Pallh  Petralia. Meta thn oloklhrwsh ths synedriashs, h k. Petralia ekane dhlwseis, oi opoies fantazomai oti sas einai gnwstes.

" O Ypoyrgos Oikonomias kai Oikonomikwn k. Giannhs Papaqanasioy kai o Yfypoyrgos Oikonomias kai Oikonomikwn k. Nikos Legkas anakoinwsan oti jekina apo shmera, M. Trith 14 Aprilioy 2009, h katabolh ths ektakths enisxyshs ycoys 500 eyrw, stoys polites poy exoyn labei stegastiko daneio kyrias katoikias kai plhroyn tis proypoqeseis toy nomoy 3756/2009 sxetika me thn ektakth enisxysh daneiolhptwn. H ektakth enisxysh  ypenqymizw  qa doqei gia stegastika daneia kyrias katoikias poy exoyn synafqei ews tis 5 Martioy 2009 me to Tameio Parakataqhkwn kai Daneiwn h me pistwtika idrymata, ta opoia leitoyrgoyn sthn Ellada.

Dikaioyxoi ths enisxyshs einai oi pashs fysews syntajioyxoi poy einai h htan dikaioyxoi toy EKAS kata to teleytaio trimhno, prin apo thn kataqesh ths diatajhs ayths sth Boylh, dhladh apo tis 5 Dekembrioy 2008 ews tis 5 Martioy 2009, kaqws kai oi anergoi poy exoyn labei epidoma apo ton OAED se opoiodhpote xroniko shmeio kata to idio diasthma.

H katabolh ths enisxyshs qa pragmatopoieitai apo ta katasthmata ths Agrotikhs Trapezas ths Ellados, me thn ypobolh sxetikhs aithshs ypeyqynhs dhlwshs, opoy qa anaferetai oti to stegastiko daneio afora se kyria katoikia kai oti o dikaioyxos den exei labei thn idia paroxh apo allh aitia.

" Qa hqela na epanalabw, epishs, mia dhlwsh thn opoia ekanan xqes oi dyo Ypoyrgoi, o k. Papaqanasioy kai o k. Legkas sxetika me ayto to qema: Me thn ektakth ayth enisxysh  eipan oi dyo Ypoyrgoi  sthrizoyme emprakta ena megalo ariqmo syntajioyxwn kai anergwn daneiolhptwn, oi opoioi briskontai se dysxerh qesh ejaitias twn epiptwsewn ths dieqnoys oikonomikhs krishs. Einai kaqhkon kai proteraiothta ths kybernhshs  to exoyme pei ayto epaneilhmmenws  sth dyskolh ayth stigmh na staqoyme dipla se ekeinoys poy einai oikonomika oi asqenesteroi sthn koinwnia mas kai pros ayth thn kateyqynsh, eimaste apofasismenoi na ejantlhsoyme kaqe dynato periqwrio.

Parakalw tis erwthseis sas.

PALAIOLOGOS: Katarxhn, an exei proypologistei posoys dikaioyxoys afora h ektakth enisxysh twn 500 eyrw;

ANTWNAROS: Den exw ayth th stigmh proxeira ta stoixeia. Eyxaristws, se ligh wra, na enhmerwqw apo to armodio Ypoyrgeio kai na sas ta dwsw thlefwnikws.

ARMENHS: Kyrie Ekproswpe, prin apo ligo, o arxhgos ths ajiwmatikhs antipoliteyshs, se syskech, den apekleise to endexomeno na exoyme diples ekloges ton Ioynio kai epishs esteile epistolh ston Proedro ths Boylhs, prokeimenoy na mhn yparjei paragrafh gia tis ypoqeseis poy diereynwntai apo th Dikaiosynh. Hqela to sxolio sas kai gia ta dyo.

ANTWNAROS: Einai dyo diaforetika qemata. Oso anafora to prwto skelos ths erwthshs, den exw na pw kati parapanw apo ayto poy exw pei epaneilhmmenws se ayth thn aiqoysa kai me kaqe eykairia. Epanalambanw ayto poy exei pei o Prwqypoyrgos: Melhma ths shmerinhs kybernhshs, ennoia ths shmerinhs kybernhshs einai h efarmogh toy oloklhrwmenoy sxedioy poy exoyme gia thn antimetwpish twn synepeiwn ths dieqnoys oikonomikhs krishs kai sth xwra mas. Ayto mas endiaferei. Ayto exei apolyth proteraiothta gia emas. Osoi eklogologoyn profanws den antilambanontai oyte ti symbainei sth xwra, oyte ti symbainei ston kosmo oloklhro. Ejyphretoyn dika toys mikrokommatika symferonta kai tipote allo.

Oso anafora to deytero skelos ths erwthshs, pragmati, prin apo ligo, symfwna me thn plhroforhsh thn opoia exw, ekproswpoi toy kommatos ths ajiwmatikhs antipoliteyshs ekanan mia dhqen parastash ston Proedro ths Boylhs kai symfwna me thn plhroforhsh moy, prokeitai na kanoyn kai mia antistoixh parastash kai ston Ypoyrgo Dikaiosynhs. H alhqeia einai aplh: Edwsan mia parastash, mia parastash kakh, mia parastash kakosthmenh, poy ligo qa mas endiefere, an den htan mia parastash poy den einai para mia akomh prospaqeia gia eyqeia parembash toy kommatos ths ajiwmatikhs antipoliteyshs sto ergo ths anejarthths Dikaiosynhs.

Profanws, den exoyn akoysei tipota gia th diakrish twn ejoysiwn, ena basiko pylwna ths Dhmokratias, se oles tis eynomoymenes koinwnies. Kai gia ayto akribws, zhtoyn pragmata poy oytws h allws einai sth fantasia toys. Zhtoyn, dhladh, apo ton Proedro ths Boylhs, ton epikefalhs ths nomoqetikhs ejoysias sthn Ellada, alla kai apo ton Ypoyrgo Dikaiosynhs, na paranomhsoyn, na drasoyn antisyntagmatika, na epemboyn sto ergo  to lew gia mia akomh fora  ths anejarthths Ellhnikhs Dikaiosynhs.

Den mas ekplhssei ayth h symperifora  sas to lew gia mia akomh fora  giati kai ayth h kinhsh toy PASOK, aparadekth, antisyntagmatikh, antiqesmikh, entassetai se mia taktikh poy akoloyqei to komma ths ajiwmatikhs antipoliteyshs, to teleytaio diasthma kai oxi mono qa elega. To teleytaio diasthma me megalyterh entash. Mia politikh poy exei dyo periexomena: Prwton, thn akrith laspologia kai deyteron, thn poinikopoihsh ths politikhs zwhs toy topoy. Aytoi poy qeloyn na fainontai dhqen ypermaxoi twn qesmwn, me tis prajeis toys apodeiknyoyn kati poly aplo: Oti toys podopatoyn toys qesmoys. Emeis, den prokeitai na symprajoyme se aytes tis meqodeyseis.

ALEIFEROPOYLOS: Kyrie Ekproswpe, meta tis plhrofories poy bgainoyn pros ta ejw apo thn Ejetastikh Epitroph, gia thn kybernhsh tiqetai hqiko qema se o,ti afora toys xeirismoys poy ekane o prwhn Ypoyrgos k. Paylidhs se sxesh me thn agora enos diamerismatos; Hqika milaw, nomika qa to krinei h Ejetastikh Epitroph.

ANTWNAROS: Qa sas apanthsw me enan kai aplo tropo. Thn kybernhsh thn endiaferei ena pragma: H plhrhs, se baqos, ejantlhtikh diereynhsh ths ypoqeshs. Opws thn endiaferei h diereynhsh kaqe ypoqeshs. Qa perimenoyme, synepws, thn oloklhrwsh ths diereynhshs ths ypoqeshs, prin topoqethqoyme. Allwste, sas to epanalambanw gia osoys den qeloyn na to katagracoyn, den qeloyn na to qymhqoyn, den qeloyn na to jeroyn, prokeitai gia diadikasia, h opoia ek toy nomoy einai mystikh.

KAKALHS: Meta kai toys ychloys tonoys kai thn polwsh poy dhmioyrgeitai sthn politikh zwh, ejakoloyqeite na epimenete oti den pame gia ekloges; Kai na apokleiete kai to senario diplwn eklogwn;

ANTWNAROS: Rwthqhka pro oligoy kai apanthsa. Thn polwsh na thn anazhthsete se aytoys poy thn prokaloyn. Ean kapoioi nomizoyn  kai ennow thn hgetikh omada toy PASOK, gia na mhn yparjei kamia amfisbhthsh  oti me politika rhxes topoqethseis mporoyn na dhmioyrghsoyn entypwseis, sfalloyn. Oi Ellhnes polites exoyn krish. Oles aytes oi kinhseis, oles aytes oi topoqethseis, oi dhmosies qeseis se ychloys tonoys, me tis opoies ekfrazontai  to teleytaio diasthma kai oxi mono, alla eidika to teleytaio diasthma  osoi periballoyn ton arxhgo toy kommatos ths ajiwmatikhs antipoliteyshs, oyte kan tis entypwseis poy qeloyn na prokalesoyn, den prokaloyn. Alla den qa menoyn se kamia periptwsh anapanthtes.

KAKALHS: Ektos apo toys ychloys tonoys sthn antiparaqesh, yparxoyn kai alles endeijeis poy synhgoroyn oti briskomaste se mia proeklogikh ekstrateia poy den exei mono san stoxo thn anadeijh twn Eyrweklogwn, opws eipate xqes. As poyme gia paradeigma blepoyme shmera na yposxeste 200.000 stremmata na entaxqoyn sto sxedio me to kainoyrgio ryqmistiko toy k. Soyflia. Xqes, kleisate to mati se 200.000 symbasioyxoys. Ola ayta den einai ceydeis endeijeis;

ANTWNAROS: Oxi. Diafwnw kaqeta mazi sas. Rwthqhka xqes, gia toys dhqen 200.000 kai topoqethqhka me jekaqaro tropo.

KAKALHS: Kai to egrace apo to myalo ths h efhmerida, pisteyete;

ANTWNAROS: Topoqethqhka ws Kybernhtikos Ekproswpos me jekaqaro tropo. Sas parakalw, diabaste to ryqmistiko sxedio gia thn Aqhna kai thn Attikh, poy einai ena megalo aithma olhs ths meizonos perioxhs ths prwteyoysas, opws to legame palia gia para polla xronia. Einai mia ``sisyfeia'' doyleia, thn opoia ekane to Ypoyrgeio, toy opoioy proistatai o k. Soyflias ta teleytaia tessera xronia.

Oloklhrwqhke ayth h meleth. Periexei poly endiaferonta stoixeia. Periexei stoixeia, ta opoia qa ejasfalisoyn se emas kai ta paidia mas poly kalyterh zwh edw ston xwro poy zoyme. Kai den briskw ton logo giati kaqe megalh doyleia, megalh prospaqeia, h opoia oloklhrwnetai meta apo tosa xronia kopiwdoys, systhmatikhs ergasias, den prepei na paroysiastei. Akribws to gegonos oti paroysiazontai ola osa ginontai ton xrono poy pragmatika ginontai, apodeiknyei ena kai mono pragma: Emas mas endiaferei h paragwgh ergoy, oysiastikoy ergoy pros ofelos olwn twn Ellhnwn politwn kai ths xwras.

STAQOPOYLOS: Na epanelqw ligo sthn erwthsh toy synadelfoy k. Armenh. O k. Papandreoy shmera, loipon, ektos apo ayta poy proeipame, eipe akoma oti gia thn oikonomikh krish eyqynetai h Nea Dhmokratia, oti ta 28 disekatommyria den epiasan topo, oti h kybernhsh den piese tis trapezes gia to qema ths reystothtas kai oti den mporei h kybernhsh na kerdisei kai na nikhsei thn faylothta.

ANTWNAROS: O k. Papandreoy, profanws, epistrefei stis ejwpragmatikes qeseis, tis opoies eixe ekfrasei prin apo ligoys mhnes. Pros stigmhn dhmioyrghqhke h entypwsh oti ekane mia prospaqeia, profanws oxi poly sobarh, na janagyrisei sthn pragmatikothta. Twra fainetai oti den anagnwrizei jana thn yparjh dieqnoys oikonomikhs krishs. Cellizoyn oi toy PASOK kati diafora gia perierges lyseis, poy proteinoyn, oi opoies bebaiws einai prwtofaneis gia ta eyrwpaika dedomena, ws ean h Ellada na einai ektos ths eyrwpaikhs pragmatikothtas. Den jerw, mporei kai na fantazetai kati tetoio o k. Papandreoy kai oi dikoi toy. Kai ola ayta deixnoyn akribws thn elleich sxedioy. Den exei kanena apolytws sxedio. Syrrafh genikothtwn, syrrafh eyxologiwn, syrrafh ejwpragmatikwn idewn. Qa elega, oyte kan gia ekqesh einai ayta ta opoia leei o k. Papandreoy.

PALAIOLOGOS: Syggnwmh, ep aytoy, alla moy dinete thn entypwsh oti emfanizete h paroysiazete ton arxhgo toy PASOK, ws ektos topoy kai xronoy.

ANTWNAROS: Me ayta poy leei;

PALAIOLOGOS: Dhladh, lete oti den exei, pera apo thn elleich sxedioy, oti cellizoyn kati diafora gia perierges lyseis, prwtofaneis. Ola ayta einai...

ANTWNAROS: Einai ayto akribws poy eipa.

PALAIOLOGOS: Se antidiastolh me poio sxedio ths kybernhshs, an moy epitrepete; Syggnwmh, alla to sxedio twn trapezwn poy sas rwthse o synadelfos prohgoymenws, den perpataei. Kai molis twra, arxizei kati na diafainetai ston orizonta, meta apo pente me eji mhnes.

ANTWNAROS: To sxedio gia th reystothta sth ellhnikh oikonomia ``perpataei'' -- gia na xrhsimopoihsw thn dikh sas ekfrash me tis dyskolies poy exoyn ola ta antistoixa sxedia se oles tis Eyrwpaikes xwres. Molis shmera to prwi, o Ypoyrgos Oikonomias synanthqhke me ekproswpoys twn megalyterwn xrhmatopistwtikwn idrymatwn kai toys epesthse thn prosoxh sthn ypoxrewsh poy exoyn na antapokriqoyn ston koinwniko toys rolo, alla kai stoys elegxoys, oi opoioi synexws, ginontai pio entatikoi. Den qa epitrecoyme se kamia periptwsh parekkliseis apo toys kanones, oi opoioi yparxoyn. Alla, sas ypenqymizw oti to qema ths reystothtas einai ena qema to opoio apasxolei olh thn Eyrwph. Kai oxi mono thn Eyrwph. Apasxolei oles tis koinwnies meta apo thn megalh ayth dieqnh oikonomikh krish, h opoia, mhn to jexnate, den exei teleiwsei. Synexizetai.

MELIGKWNHS: Wstoso k. Ekproswpe edw kai mhnes toso o ypoyrgos Oikonomias, oso kai o prohgoymenos ypoyrgos Oikonomias alla kai eseis apo ayto ekei to bhma lete ayto to pragma. Efistate stoys trapezites thn prosoxh kai toys lete na antapokriqoyn ston koinwniko toys rolo. Kai parola ayta, pros to paron toylaxiston, to sxedio twn 28 dis fainetai oti den proxwraei. Den blepete oti ayto den einai arketo;

ANTWNAROS: Oxi. Mhn pate se alla qemata kai mhn bgazete symperasmata sta opoia egw den exw katalhjei. Egw den eipa tipota ap'ola ayta. Eipa oti den perpataei me ton ryqmo kai thn perpathsia poy emeis qa qelame na exei. Kai gi ayto akribws ginontai apo thn pleyra ths kybernhshs  kai eimai bebaios kai apo thn pleyra ths Trapezas ths Ellados  oles oi parembaseis, oles oi ypodeijeis oi opoies einai qesmika dynato na ginoyn.

Apo thn allh meria, na sas ypenqymisw gia mia akomh fora oti exei megalh apotelesmatikothta to programma poy TEMPME; Dhladh ths paroxhs daneiwn se mikres kai poly mikres epixeirhseis. Molis thn perasmenh bdomada o armodios ypoyrgos o k. Kwsths Xatzhdakhs paroysiase to deytero stadio toy TEMPME. An den me apataei h mnhmh moy sto prwto stadio exoyn egkriqei kat'arxhn 27.000  sygxwreiste me an o ariqmos den einai apolyta akribhs  aithseis tetoiwn epixeirhsewn.

Antilambaneste loipon oti eimaste edw, h koinwnia einai edw kai emeis, h ellhnikh Politeia  egw milw gia thn Politeia  steketai dipla ths, arwgos. Molis shmera h kyria Petralia paroysiase ena poly eyry plaisio drasewn apo tis opoies orismenes einai hdh se ejelijh, alles prokeitai na arxisoyn, enw alles qa dromologhqoyn argotera mesa sto trexon etos kai exoyn ena stoxo: Na qwrakisoyn tis qeseis ergasias. Na prostateysoyn kai na sthrijoyn osoys den exoyn doyleia, oxi mono logw ths krishs alla kai prin.

Kai, opws eipe h kyria Petralia, prosarmozetai akomh kai to ESPA apo to opoio qa xrhmatodothqoyn to 70% me 80% aytwn twn drasewn, stis anagkes poy dhmioyrgei h krish. Aytes einai draseis shmantikes gia th sthrijh ekeinwn poy exoyn pragmatika anagkh. Gia th sthrijh newn epixeirhmatiwn. Gia th sthrijh anqrwpwn poy doyleyoyn se tomeis opws einai o toyrismos, gia paradeigma, poy mporei na antimetwpisei kapoia problhmata, alla taytoxrona einai poly shmantikos tomeas gia th xwra mas. Kai ola ayta pera apo ta eidika metra poy exei apofasisei h kybernhsh kai efarmozontai hdh gia thn toyristikh biomhxania, an kai den moy aresei poly h lejh ``toyristikh biomhxania'', protimw na lew gia ton toyrismo, gia ton tomea toy toyrismoy. Opws gnwrizete polles ekatontades xiliades sympolitwn mas apasxoloyntai s ayto ton tomea poy einai zwtikhs shmasias gia thn oikonomia ths xwras mas alla kai gia thn koinwnia genikotera.

GKATSIOS: Kyrie Ekproswpe, anarwtiemai an ystera ap ola ayta poy eipate gia ton proedro toy PASOK kai gia thn hgetikh omada ths ajiwmatikhs antipoliteyshs, to meizon qema ths synaineshs gia thn antimetwpish ths oikonomikhs krishs brisketai akomh sto trapezi.

ANTWNAROS: H synennohsh einai panta to megalo aithma. To megalo aithma ths ellhnikhs koinwnias. Emeis antapokrinomaste s ayto to aithma. Exoyme parei sygkekrimenes prwtoboylies. Qymaste oti o Prwqypoyrgos kalese toys arxhgoys olwn twn koinoboyleytikwn kommatwn se proswpikes synanthseis kai toys paroysiase eji basikes arxes stis opoies emeis pisteyoyme oti mporoyn ta kommata na synennohqoyn. Den perimenoyme apo ta kommata, ws kybernhsh, thn plhrh sthrijh twn politikwn mas. Einai fysiko ayto. To kaqe komma exei th dikh toy proseggish se polla qemata. Alla den mporei kapoioi na lene epi monimoy basews oxi se ola, giati etsi nomizoyn oti dhqen ejyphretoyn ta dika toys mikrokommatika symferonta. Ayto to ``oxi'' qa to broyn mprosta toys.

KAKALHS: Na epanelqw sto qema ths reystothtas. Gia na sxhmatisei gnwmh kai h koinwnia sthn opoia anaferqhkate prin, mporeite na mas dwsete sygkekrimena stoixeia, posa disekatommyria exoyn metaferqei sthn pragmatikh oikonomia; Posa dhladh exoyn doqei gia daneia se noikokyria, posa exoyn doqei gia mikromesaies epixeirhseis k.lp.;

ANTWNAROS: Ayta einai stoixeia poy qa prepei na ta zhthsete apo to ypoyrgeio Oikonomias.

KAKALHS: Me sygxwreite, eseis den exete endiaferqei san kybernhsh; Den sas enhmerwse sthn epitroph o ypoyrgos;

ANTWNAROS: Enhmerwnomai synexws gia oles tis ptyxes ths kybernhtikhs politikhs.

KAKALHS: Xqes synedriase to symboylio, me sygxwreite.

ANTWNAROS: Ayth th stigmh den exw sygkekrimena stoixeia na sas dwsw.

KAKALHS: Den ta exete edw kai 2,5 mhnes, omws. Edw kai dyo-treis mhnes den ta exete pote. Einai tyxaio ayto;

ANTWNAROS: Sas exw dwsei, palaiotera, stoixeia. Kai alles fores sas exw dwsei polla stoixeia, sas exw dwsei ariqmoys. Egw den eimai apo ekeinoys poy wraiopoioyn katastaseis. To jerete.

KAKALHS: Eipate oti einai apotelesmatikos o elegxos. Pws to lete ayto;

ANTWNAROS: Sas eipa: O elegxos ginetai oloena kai pio apotelesmatikos. Alla ypenqymizw gia mia akomh fora, oti to problhma ths reystothtas to antimetwpizoyn oles oi koinwnies, eite qeloyme na to paradextoyme, eite den qeloyme na to paradextoyme. Parola tayta qa ginoyn akomh perissotera apo thn pleyra mas, etsi wste na antimetwpistoyn ta problhmata.

ARMENHS: Pantws k. Ekproswpe ton Ianoyario  diabazw symfwna me thn Eqnikh Statistikh Yphresia  h anergia eftase to 9,4%, apo 8% poy htan ton Ianoyario toy 2008.

ANTWNAROS: Den yparxei kamia amfibolia oti h krish qigei, dhmioyrgei problhmata sthn apasxolhsh. Einai dynaton mia tetoia krish, se tetoia eyreia klimaka, na mhn dhmioyrghsei problhmata apasxolhshs; Apo thn allh meria omws sas ypenqymizw oti egkairws, poly prin apo ton Ianoyario  kai ayto einai shmantiko  h shmerinh kybernhsh eixe epejergastei me ta prwta shmadia ths krishs programmata qwrakishs ths apasxolhshs. Programmata wste to epidoma anergias na ginei epidoma apasxolhshs. Qymaste oti kapoioi eixan speysei na kakologhsoyn  gia na mhn xrhsimopoihsw xeiroterh ekfrash  aytes tis prwtoboylies.

Fantasteite poio qa htan to apotelesma ths krishs ean ta teleytaia xronia, apo to 2004 kai meta, den eixan ginei systhmatikes prospaqeies kai me th synexh anaptyjh kai me alles prwtoboylies poy exoyn lhfqei, wste na meiwqei h anergia apo to pososto toy 11% syn, poy thn afhsan oi kybernhseis toy PASOK, se pososto katw apo 8% poy htan mexri tis arxes, to jespasma, ths krishs. Fantasteite loipon ti qa ginotan ean den eixan lhfqei ola ta sygkekrimena metra. Ayto fainetai se alles xwres, synafeis me thn Ellada, poy antimetwpizoyn ychlotatoys dichfioys ariqmoys anergias, poy aggizoyn dhladh san pososta akomh kai to 18-20%.

MPOILE: Th deyterh dikografia gia thn ypoqesh Paylidh thn melethsate;

ANTWNAROS: Den exw na prosqesw kati se osa eipa xqes.

ALEIFEROPOYLOS: Se synexeia ths erwthshs toy k. Armenh, k. Ekproswpe, qelw na sas rwthsw to ejhs: Yparxei mia problech gia to trexon etos oti oi anergoi mporei na aggijoyn tis 100.000.

ANTWNAROS: Ennoeite oi neoi anergoi;

ALEIFEROPOYLOS: Oi neoi anergoi. Mporei na aggijoyn kai tis 100.000 logw ths oikonomikhs krishs sth xwra mas. Hqela na sas rwthsw ean mhpws h kyria Petralia, sth synedriash poy prohghqhke, anefere ariqmoys. Dhladh ean ta metra poy proteine, to plaisio ayto gyrw apo to opoio qa epidiwjei h kybernhsh na prostateysei toys ergazomenoys kai na anaptyjei nees qeseis ergasias, an anefere kapoioys ariqmoys. Ayto qa hqela na maqw.

ANTWNAROS: Oxi, den egine anafora se ariqmoys. Ekeino to opoio mas endiaferei, einai kaqe anqrwpos poy exei th doyleia toy, gia kaqe antra kai kaqe gynaika poy exoyn mia doyleia na breqoyn tropoi wste na diathrhsoyn tis doyleies toys.

ZORMPA: Kyrie Ekproswpe, ej oswn antilambanomai apo thn prosfath apanthsh sas, teleytaia alla kai progenestera, sxetika me thn eklogologia, thn petra toy eklogologikoy anaqematos thn petate sto PASOK. Anarwtiemai ean eseis ektimate ws kybernhsh, an exete yparjei eparkws jekaqaroi sxetika me th boylhsh sas na mhn odhghsete th xwra se prowres kalpes, an eiste se qesh na eiste apolytws jekaqaroi s ayto kai an nai poy apodidete ayto to fainomeno toy oti h spora ths eklogologias briskei prosforo edafos sthn politikh zwh toy topoy synexeia.

ANTWNAROS: Prwta ap ola gi ayto to qema exei topoqethqei o Prwqypoyrgos prosfata, opws kai polles alles fores. Den epiqymw na epistrecw se ayto. H syzhthsh aplws kai mono aytoy toy qematos trofodotei akribws thn eklogologia h opoia den exei kamia bash, den prepei na exei kamia bash sth shmerinh ellhnikh pragmatikothta. Ekeino poy xreiazetai h xwra einai h kybernhsh ths na einai panw apo ta problhmata, opws kai einai h shmerinh kybernhsh. Na dinei lyseis kai na mhn asxoleitai, opws den asxoleitai, me qemata poy einai kaqara mikrokommatikoy endiaferontos, opws einai ayta me ta opoia asxoleitai h hgetikh omada toy PASOK. To mono poy thn endiaferei  to lew gia mia akomh fora  einai profanws ayth h boylimia gia ejoysia poy exoyn, an oxi o k. Papandreoy, opwsdhpote kapoioi gyrw kai dipla apo ton k. Papandreoy. Syndromo anypomonhsias einai ayto. Qa perimenoyn gia poly akomh.

KAKALHS: Me sygxwreite, alla h anabolh toy tajidioy toy k. Meimarakh stis HPA den syndeetai me toys eklogikoys sxediasmoys ths kybernhshs;

ANTWNAROS: Egw den gnwrizw oyte gia tajidi, oyte gia anabolh, na sas to pw apla. Alla yparxei mia tash, qa milhsw genikotera, kapoio gegonos to opoio den exei kamia sxesh me ena allo, na ginetai prospaqeia na syndeqoyn. Den exoyn kamia sxesh. Qa sas pw oti sto idio diasthma o prwqypoyrgos exei programmatismena polla alla tajidia edw kai kairo. Jafnika loipon, bghkan orismenoi kai eipan oti o prwqypoyrgos etsi, apo th mia mera sthn allh, programmatise tajidia ta opoia einai programmatismena sthn atzenta toy, problepomena an qelete, gia na xrhsimopoihsoyme enan akribestero oro, edw kai mhnes. Dioti den mporeite fysika na moy peite oti h synanthsh sth Barsobia apofasisthke tis teleytaies hmeres, oyte h Synodos h opoia prokeitai na ginei sth Sofia apofasisthke tis teleytaies hmeres.

KAKALHS: Qa paei sth Sofia;

ANTWNAROS: Ti sas eipa; Problepomena tajidia. Ejartatai telika apo kapoioys paragontes an pragmatopoihqoyn diafora tajidia, gia ta opoia ginetai proetoimasia. Kai sas ypenqymizw th gnwsth istoria me to tajidi sthn Aystralia poy eseis epimenate oti qa ginei se kapoio xroniko shmeio kai sas elega oti den exei oristikopoihqei. Ta tajidia oristikopoioyntai th stigmh poy ryqmizontai oles oi leptomereies. Den oristikopoioyntai prin.

MELIGKWNHS: Kyrie Ekproswpe eipate prin oti ``osoi lene oxi se ola qa to broyn mprosta toys''. Ti akribws ennoeite; To PASOK qa to plhrwsei stis eyrwekloges; Ayto lete;

ANTWNAROS: Mporeite na kanete opoia ermhneia qelete. Eseis qelete na epikentrwneste stis eyrwekloges. Qa moy epitrecete na exw eyryterh eikona toy politikoy gignesqai sthn Ellada.

PALAIOLOGOS: Qa synexisw thn eystoxh erwthsh ths synadelfoy kyrias Zormpa. Den eida omws na apanthsete otan sas ``prokalese'' na jekaqarisete ean den qa ginoyn diples ekloges...

ANTWNAROS: Egw qewrw oti h apanthsh poy exei dwsei o Prwqypoyrgos einai apolytws jekaqarh.

PALAIOLOGOS: Rixnete monimws to mpalaki sto PASOK oti eklogologei, oti h eklogologia den symferei, den eipate omws kathgorhmatika oyte ap'ayto to bhma oti den qa ginoyn diples ekloges se ... (den akoygetai)

ANTWNAROS: Prin apo liges meres topoqethqhke ep' aytoy o Prwqypoyrgos. Ean eseis kai orismenoi alloi edw kai alloy qeloyn na anamasoyn thn idia karamela, den exoyn para na to kanoyn. Egw to briskw ligo bareto. M aresei na allazw geyseis.

ZORMPA: Kyrie Ekproswpe, proseja shmera stis apanthseis sas oti balate kata toy periballontos toy arxhgoy ths ajiwmatikhs antipoliteyshs dyo fores, alla oxi eyqews kata toy k. Papandreoy. Ayth h metastrofh shmainei kati;

ANTWNAROS: Oxi. Mhn to lete ayto. Edw moy eipan oi synadelfoi sas akribws to antiqeto. Ypeyqynos gia ola osa symbainoyn sto PASOK kai gia oles tis kinhseis kai tis prwtoboylies toy PASOK, einai enas kai mono. O arxhgos toy.

GKATSIOS: Egw qa synexisw ligo me thn eklogologia. Stoxos ths kybernhshs einai na ejantlhsei thn tetraetia;

ANTWNAROS: Topoqethqhka gia ola ayta ta qemata me safhneia. Den exw na prosqesw kati.

ARMENHS: Ena sxolio gia tis toyrkikes parabiaseis kata th diarkeia ths episkechs toy Prwqypoyrgoy sth fregata ``CARRA'', exete;

ANTWNAROS: H Ellada gnwrizei na yperaspizetai apotelesmatika ola ta eqnika ths dikaia. Kai kanei opoy xreiazetai tis parastaseis kai tis energeies poy epiballontai.

Sas eyxaristw.

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