Greek government Press Briefing, 98-01-27

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From: The Hellenic Ministry of Press & Mass Media <http://www.minpress.gr/>

YPOYRGEIO TYPOY & MESWN MAZIKHS ENHMERWSHS

Aqhna, 27.1.1998

H ENHMERWSH TWN POLITIKWN SYNTAKTWN KAI TWN ANTAPOKRITWN JENOY TYPOY APO TON YPOYRGO TYPOY & MESWN MAZIKHS ENHMERWSHS KAI KYBERNHTIKO EKPROSWPO DHMHTRH REPPA

Geia sas.

Akoyw tis erwthseis sas.

SOYGLERHS: Yparxei kati neotero apo th syskech gia tis DEKO; Mporeite na mas peite ti qa syzhthqei;

REPPAS: Exei oristei synanthsh toy k. Papantwnioy, toy k. Papaiwannoy kai toy k. Mantelh me tis hgesies twn ergatikwn syndikatwn, opoy h Kybernhsh qa pei thn apoch ths. Elpizoyme na prokycei symptwsh apocewn. H synanthsh ayth qa ginei shmera to apogeyma. Parakalw, loipon, na perimenoyme th synanthsh ayth, elpizontas oti ola qa pane kala.

PARIS: Ek twn ysterwn, opws einai twra ta pragmata, h Kybernhsh qewrei oti to na ferei ayto to problhma me tis DEKO ypo morfhn tropologias, mias aplhs tropologias sth Boylh, htan laqos; Mhpws eprepe na exei prohghqei mia poly megalyterh syzhthsh panw s' ayto to qema; Ston koinwniko dialogo ayto to qema den eixe prokycei kaqoloy, poy einai kata bash, kat' ejoxhn qema koinwnikoy dialogoy.

REPPAS: Apanthsame gi' ayta ta qemata meta apo polla sxetika erwthmata. Eipa oti to qema ayto mas apasxolhse, otan syzhthsame ta toy proypologismoy kai toy forologikoy nomosxedioy, afoy eixe oloklhrwqei o koinwnikos dialogos. Einai ena qema, to opoio apotelei antikeimeno kai gia ton koinwniko dialogo. H diatajh ayth den einai prosqhkh. Perilambanotan ej arxhs sto forologiko nomosxedio, to opoio exoyme proteinei. Dhladh, den prosteqhke argotera. En pash periptwsei, eipame poios einai o stoxos. Oson afora thn oikonomikh politikh, pisteyoyme oti den einai dynato na epityxoyme toys dhmosionomikoys stoxoys kai kyriws thn ejygiansh twn epixeirhsewn, na tis katasthsoyme dhladh antagwnistikes, an den epidiwjoyme na lysoyme to megalo problhma twn elleimmatwn. An den pacoyn, dhladh, na einai zhmiogones oi epixeirhseis aytes, toylaxiston sto baqmo poy einai shmera. Me ayth thn ennoia proxwrhsame s' ayth thn prwtoboylia. Pisteyoyme oti me kalh pisth kai oi ergazomenoi, sth shmerinh synanthsh, qa proseggisoyn to qema kai elpizoyme na yparjei symptwsh apocewn.

KWNSTANTINIDHS: Kyrie Ypoyrge, poso problhmatise h poso anhsyxei thn Ellhnikh Kybernhsh to neo epeisodio sta Imia apo ta toyrkika ploia;

REPPAS: Gia to epeisodio ayto, to opoio egine xqes, qa ginei diabhma apo ton Ellhna presbh sthn Agkyra. Pragmati, toyrkika ploia parabiasan toys kanones ths ablaboys dieleyshs, epeidh den eixan staqerh taxythta kata thn pleysh toys h den apefygan toys eligmoys, alla kai epeidh oi andres twn ploiwn xrhsimopoihsan ta opla toys. Ayto to epeisodio den eixe megalh xronikh diarkeia. To ellhniko polemiko ploio, me to mhnyma h thn protroph thn opoia aphyqyne, odhghse se apomakrynsh twn dyo toyrkikwn ploiwn. Gia to qema ayto enhmerwqhke to Ypoyrgeio Ejwterikwn. Oi diplwmatikes energeies oi opoies qa ginoyn shmera, qa anadeijoyn to qema me th diatypwsh twn qesewn mas sthn prwteyoysa ths Toyrkias.

KWNSTANTINIDHS: Ayto to paixnidi mexri pote qa synexistei; Mia sto aera, mia sth qalassa, ti qa ginei;

REPPAS: Milhsame kat' epanalhch gia thn atakth stratiwtikh drash ths Toyrkias. Eipame akribws poso epikindynh einai ayth h symperifora gia thn eirhnh kai th staqerothta sthn perioxh. Kai gi' ayto akribws h Kybernhsh diatypwse dia stomatos toy k. Pagkaloy -kai oxi mono- thn protash, ola ta qemata ta opoia h Toyrkia qewrei oti apoteloyn ajiwseis ths, mporei na ta antimetwpisei mesw toy Dikasthrioy ths Xaghs, afoy bebaiws dexqei prohgoymenws th genikh dikaiodosia toy Dikasthrioy, anti na prosfeygei se tetoioy eidoys energeies, tis opoies apodokimazoyme oloi.

FILHS: Lete "xrhsimopoihsan opla". Ti akribws egine;

REPPAS: Pyrobolhsan me ta opla ta opoia o kaqenas apo toys andres aytoys eixe sth diaqesh toy.

FILHS: Ston aera;

REPPAS: Ston aera.

FILHS: Ayto einai ena synhqismeno gegonos;

REPPAS: Einai kati to opoio mporei na ginetai. Den qa elega oti einai synhqismeno, giati tetoioy eidoys pleyseis den ginontai kaqe mera. Me ayth thn ennoia, den einai synhqismeno to gegonos ayto. Alla, to oti polles fores rixnontai aytoi oi pyrobolismoi ston aera, mporei na pei kapoios oti einai kati poy symbainei. Ayto den shmainei omws, oti payei na einai mia energeia h opoia synista parabash kanonwn. Me ayth thn ennoia thn apodokimazoyme kai gi' ayto akribws probainoyme sthn analogh diplwmatikh energeia.

MOYRTHS: Epeidh anaferqhkate pali sto Dieqnes Dikasthrio ths Xaghs, h opoia apofash toy Dikasthrioy ths Xaghs einai desmeytikh gia ta melh poy prosfeygoyn s' ayto;

REPPAS: Gnwrizete poly kala, oti den yparxei qema ayth thn wra poy syzhtoyme -kai diatypwnete kai eseis thn erwthsh sas- to Dikasthrio ths Xaghs na epilhfqei opoioydhpote qematos. Apaiteitai mia seira apo proypoqeseis, oi opoies efoson ikanopoihqoyn tote mporoyme na milame gia thn enasxolhsh toy Dikasthrioy ths Xaghs me sygkekrimeno qema. Ayto einai kati poly makrino. Mporw na sas pw, oti opoios dexetai thn anagkastikh dikaiodosia, bebaiws dexetai tis apofaseis toy. Exoyme dextei, omws, emeis th dikaiodosia, me ejairesh qemata poy aforoyn thn asfaleia kai thn amyna ths xwras. H Toyrkia den exei dextei th dikaiodosia toy Dikasthrioy, genikws.

MOYRTHS: Qa anaferw ena paradeigma: Oi HPA, epishs, eixan anagnwrisei th genikh dikaiodosia toy Dieqnoys Dikasthrioy ths Xaghs. Otan katadikasthkan gia thn yponomeysh twn limaniwn ths Nikaragoyas, apo to Dieqnes Dikasthrio, den efarmosan thn apofash.

REPPAS: Kai oi HPA, exoyn zhthsei ejairesh gia qemata poy aforoyn thn asfaleia toys. Mporw na pw oti to "montelo apodoxhs" ths dikaiodosias toy Dikasthrioy ths Xaghs poy exoyme epilejei emeis, einai ayto poy exoyn epilejei kai oi HPA.

SOYGLERHS: Me poio tropo skeptetai na antidrasei h Kybernhsh, meta th dhmosiopoihsh twn stoixeiwn poy edwse o OOSA, symfwna me ta opoia h xwra mas to 1997 eixe 13 dis jeplyma mayroy xrhmatos, apo ta opoia 8 dis apo ta narkwtika.

REPPAS: Ola ayta ta qemata, ta opoia apoteloyn kai koinwnika problhmata, nomizw oti prepei na antimetwpistoyn, kata proteraiothta, afenos me ton eksygxronismo twn Yphresiwn toy Dhmosioy kai afeteroy apo tis armodies dikastikes kai diwktikes Arxes. Giati ayta ta fainomena exoyn parenergeies kai dhmioyrgoyn polla problhmata sthn omalh leitoyrgia ths koinwnias mas. Ta stoixeia toy dieqnoys aytoy organismoy, epishmainoyn ena problhma to opoio -qa elega- se megalytero h mikrotero baqmo antimetwpizoyn oles oi xwres.

FILHS: Synexizontai kapoies dhmoskophseis poy emfanizoyn thn Kybernhsh na einai se ptwtikh poreia kai ton Prwqypoyrgo proswpika na exei mia katakoryfh ptwsh ths dhmotikothtas toy. Epeidh den einai ena, den einai dyo. Yparxei kapoia antidrash ek meroys ths Kybernhshs, otan emfanizetai o Prwqypoyrgos na exei toso xamhlh dhmotikothta, wste na parei kapoies prwtoboylies, gia na anasthlwsei th dhmotikothta toy kai thn aphxhsh ths Kybernhshs;

REPPAS: Den qa krinoyme ta apotelesmata twn dhmoskophsewn. Ta apotelesmata twn dhmoskophsewn prokyptoyn meta apo sygkekrimenes erwthseis, oi opoies tiqentai. Exoyn sxesh me ton tropo, me ton opoio tiqentai oi erwthseis kai, bebaiws, aphxoyn tis diaqeseis ths koinhs gnwmhs mia orismenh stigmh. Ayto to opoio arkoymai twra na tonisw einai toyto: H Kybernhsh kanei mia poly megalh prospaqeia gia ton eksygxronismo kai thn anaptyjh ths xwras. Proxwra se diarqrwtikes allages, oi opoies exoyn kai politiko kostos kai ayto to anagnwrizoyme. Qewroyme, omws, oti den prepei oi epiloges aytes, epeidh akribws einai anagkaies, na anastaloyn en onomati toy foboy toy politikoy kostoys, to opoio synepagontai. Pisteyoyme oti h politikh poy akoloyqoyme einai h orqh politikh, odhgei thn Ellada ston 21o aiwna me tis ajiwseis mias isxyrhs xwras. Me ayth thn ennoia kaloyme to synolo twn politwn, sto plaisio ths synergasias kai ths synennohshs, na dwsoyme th maxh, prokeimenoy na epityxoyme ayto to stoxo, para to oti proskaira dhmioyrgoyntai entypwseis h problhmata. Thn wra twn eklogwn, otan oloklhrwsoyme th qhteia mas, pisteyw oti to ergo mas qa einai tetoio, poy oloys qa toys exei peisei, wste tote h "dhmoskophsh" ayth poy legetai "boyleytikes ekloges" na exei epityxh apotelesmata gia thn Kybernhsh kai gia thn Ellada.

FILHS: Qa exei prohghqei "dhmoskophsh" kai apo tis dhmotikes ekloges.

REPPAS: Exoyme milhsei gia to xarakthra twn dhmotikwn kai nomarxiakwn eklogwn. Exoyme ekdwsei kai sxetikh apofash sthn eidikh Synodo ths Kentrikhs Epitrophs poy ekane to PASOK sto Nayplio, poy parapempei se ayta ta qemata, gia thn ajia poy exei gia tis topikes koinwnies kai thn antimetwpish twn problhmatwn kaqe perioxhs, to apotelesma twn eklogwn sthn kateyqynsh ths epikrathshs proodeytikwn syndyasmwn, wste me proodeytika programmata na antimetwpisoyme ta sxetika problhmata.

FILHS: Qema allaghs Ypoyrgwn yparxei, kyrie Ypoyrge;

REPPAS: Den yparxei tetoio qema.

MIXAHL: Eipate oti den prepei aytes oi megales allages na anastaloyn logw politikoy kostoys. Se syndyasmo me tis apanthseis poy dwsate stis arxikes erwthseis gia thn tropologia twn DEKO k.lp. eipate oti einai anagkaio na ginoyn aytes oi allages, gia na leitoyrghsoyn oi Dhmosies Yphresies. Qa hqela na sas rwthsw, giati den analabate, oso sas aforoyse, to politiko kostos ta prohgoymena xronia gia na mhn exoyme aytes tis entonotates sygkroyseis shmera;

REPPAS: Gnwrizete poly kala pws dhmioyrghqhkan ayta ta ychla elleimmata stis epixeirhseis kai stoys organismoys toy Dhmosioy. H Kybernhsh, sto plaisio enos plhroys programmatos gia thn antimetwpish aytwn twn problhmatwn, proxwra se diarqrwtikes allages. Exei ena tetoio programma, wste me epityxia na antimetwpisei ta problhmata, oxi spasmwdika, oxi peristasiaka, alla me sxediasmenh drash. H prwtoboylia ayth gia th sygkekrimenh ryqmish, pisteyoyme oti telika qa brei thn apodoxh kai twn idiwn twn ergazomenwn se aytes tis DEKO. Giati pisteyoyme oti thn apodoxh apo th megalh pleiochfia twn Ellhnwn politwn, hdh, thn exei. Exw th gnwmh oti oi eji mhnes -xroniko diasthma to opoio proteinei h Kybernhsh- einai arketos xronos, wste ajiopoioymenos na dwsei th dynatothta, me ta mexri twra isxyonta, th diadikasia dhladh twn syllogikwn diapragmateysewn, na odhghqoyme se lyseis aytwn twn problhmatwn. Na proxwrhsoyme, dhladh, stis aparaithtes allages poy qa apotelesoyn ena akomh oplo gia thn ejygiansh aytwn twn epixeirhsewn. Exw th gnwmh, loipon, oti oi prospaqeies tis opoies kanoyme prepei katw apo ayto to prisma na ejetazontai. Kai pisteyw oti qa broyn aphxhsh telikws kai se ekeinoys poy shmera einai sfodra polemioi.

MIXAHL: Milhsate gia sxediasmenh drash. Ayth, dhladh, den yphrxe ta prohgoymena xronia;

REPPAS: Gnwrizete oti ta problhmata ths ellhnikhs koinwnias einai para polla. Asfalws, to programma enos kommatos -kai malista kybernhtikoy kommatos- anaferetai se ola ayta ta problhmata. Yparxei mia ierarxhsh kai bebaia ejetazontai kai oi katallhles synqhkes, kaqe fora, oi opoies epitrepoyn na kaneis thn alfa h th bhta kinhsh. Prepei na sas pw oti ta problhmata einai polla. Isws sto plaisio ths qhteias ths mia Kybernhsh den einai eykolo na antimetwpisei kai na lysei ta problhmata. Ayto symbainei se oles tis koinwnies, oxi mono sthn patrida mas. Ara, loipon, yparxei programma kai sth bash ths efarmoghs aytoy toy programmatos exoyme shmantika apotelesmata se polloys tomeis, stoys opoioys anaptyjame th drash mas. Kai ean qelete mporw na anaferqw me leptomereies se tetoioys tomeis.

MIXAHL: Egw sas rwthsa poly sygkekrimena. Sta prohgoymena xronia den yphrje sxediasmenh drash; Kybernhsh toy PASOK htan.

REPPAS: Ean qelete kati allo, poy einai pio apokalyptiko na sas qymisw oti, to 1996 proxwrhsame se ayth th ryqmish exontas chfisei th diatajh sto nomo 2414 gia ton eksygxronismo twn DEKO, symfwna me thn opoia apaiteitai h symfwnh gnwmh twn ergazomenwn, prokeimenoy na allajoyn oi genikoi kanonismoi proswpikoy se mia epixeirhsh toy Dhmosioy. Einai h paragrafos 10 toy arqroy 4 toy nomoy 2414. Emeis oi idioi, exontas thn empeiria ths leitoyrgias orismenwn DEKO poy einai zhmiogones kai paroysiazoyn ychla elleimmata, prepei na proxwrhsoyme se allagh, h opoia exei diarqrwtiko xarakthra kai einai aparaithth gia na katasthsoyme aytes tis dhmosies epixeirhseis pio antagwnistikes.

PARIS: Ola ta oikonomika metra ta opoia pairnei h Kybernhsh, ta opoia xarakthrizontai arketa antilaika, ta pairnei sto onoma toy koinoy eyrwpaikoy nomismatos. H erwthsh einai h ejhs: Pisteyei h Kybernhsh oti o ellhnikos laos exei katalabei ti einai akribws to koino eyrwpaiko nomisma h exei kanei th doyleia ths, wste na dwsei ston ellhniko lao na katalabei ti einai ayto, pera apo to na leei oti ejw apo ayth thn poreia yparxei katastrofh;

REPPAS: Kyrie Paris, qa diafwnhsw mazi sas oti ta metra exoyn antilaiko xarakthra. To na epityxeis na apoklimakwseis ton plhqwrismo, einai mia epityxia h opoia afora toys polites, afora toys polloys. Den afora toys ligoys. Me to xamhlo plhqwrismo -gnwrizete para poly kala- h to kleisimo twn elleimmatwn, enisxyetai h oikonomikh qesh ths xwras kai etsi bohqoyntai oi koinwnika adynamoi na enisxysoyn kai th dikh toys qesh. M' ayth thn ennoia, ta metra ayta den einai antilaika. Asfalws, epanalambanw, den einai panta eyxarista kai synepagontai politiko kostos. Alla, apo thn allh, h Oikonomikh kai Nomismatikh Enwsh apotelei gia mas prwtarxiko stoxo. Pisteyoyme oti einai adianohto h Ellada na parameinei ejw apo ta kentra ayta opoy qa lambanontai oi apofaseis, gia thn Eyrwph h ton planhth mas, ta epomena xronia. Einai aparaithto na entaxqoyme sthn Oikonomikh kai Nomismatikh Enwsh. Dexomai oti o ellhnikos laos den einai, isws, eparkws enhmerwmenos, gia to ti shmainei o apokleismos ths Ellados apo thn ONE h gia to ti shmainei h entajh mas sthn ONE me oti eyergetika apotelesmata synepagetai ayto. Asfalws, xreiazetai perissoterh enhmerwsh. Isws einai kai dikh mas ypoxrewsh na symbaloyme s' ayth thn kateyqynsh. Nomizw, omws, oti se genikes grammes o ellhnikos laos gnwrizei thn ajia poy exei h prospaqeia mas gia na entaxqoyme sthn ONE.

FILHS: Xqes, eixate thn prwtoboylia na zhthsete apo to ESR na syzhthsei to qema toy biasmoy ths 11xronhs kopelas apo thn thleorash. Epeidh to qema dhmioyrghqhke apo efhmerida kai bebaiws epeidh stis armodiothtes toy Radiothleoptikoy Symboylioy den einai na ejetazei dhmosieymata, basei twn opoiwn dhmioyrgeitai kapoio problhma, ean prokeitai na labete kapoia prwtoboylia dialogoy me tis efhmerides, gia to pws qa prepei, me aformh ayto to dhmosieyma, na xeirizontai paromoia qemata.

REPPAS: Qa kanw dyo parathrhseis: Prwton, to Symboylio Radiothleorashs asxoleitai me ta programmata twn hlektronikwn, opws ta leme, Meswn Enhmerwshs. H dikh moy paraggelia pros to Symboylio Radiothleorashs na asxolhqei me to qema, afora ton tropo me ton opoio problhqhke to gegonos. Opws problepei o nomos alla kai o sxetikos Kwdikas Deontologias, den prepei na paroysiazontai ta stoixeia gia sygkekrimena proswpa me tetoio tropo, wste otan anaferomaste se anhlikoys na einai eykolo na gnwrisei, na entopisei kapoios poio einai to anhliko atomo gia to opoio ginetai o logos. Ayto, opws ta hlektronika Mesa Enhmerwshs probalan to qema, fainetai oti den thrhqhke ws arxh kai gi' ayto to Symboylio Radiothleorashs prepei na ejetasei to qema. Kai deyteron, oson afora ton Typo den exei dikaiodosia to ESR. Den exoyme antimetwpisei, ws Kybernhsh, to qema epanaforas kapoiwn diatajewn nomoy, prokeimenoy na epibaloyme periorismoys. Einai, ta problhmata aytoy toy xarakthra, problhmata poy mporei kai prepei na antimetwpistoyn me thn isxyoysa nomoqesia. Symplhrwnw, legontas sas oti o Ypoyrgos Dikaiosynhs k. Giannopoylos, gia ta qemata ayta poy aforoyn ton Typo, ton "kitrinismo" h ton eytelismo ston Typo, exei apeyqynqei se nomikes panepisthmiakes sxoles, stoys dikhgorikoys syllogoys, se alloys foreis na diatypwsoyn tis apoceis toys, gia to an einai aparaithto na qespistoyn nees diatajeis gi' ayta ta qemata. Den protiqetai h Kybernhsh na proxwrhsei monomerws, me prwtoboylia dhladh poy qa analabei h idia, xwris na symfwnoyn oi foreis poy exoyn gnwmh kai idiaiterws gia ta qemata ayta, se kapoia allh ryqmish.

FILHS: Den sas rwthsa ayto to qema, alla ontws bghke mia eidhsh. Den rwthsa an qa analabete prwtoboylia diwjhs h alloy typoy katastaltikh prwtoboylia. Alimono. Rwthsa an qa analabete prwtoboylia, politistikoy xarakthra, dialogoy me tis efhmerides.

REPPAS: Exoyme pei oti ta qemata ayta prepei na antimetwpizontai sto plaisio ths aytoryqmishs. Mia skech mas -kai mpainoyme pia sta qemata toy Ypoyrgeioy mas- einai na syzhthsoyme me toys foreis ths entyphs enhmerwshs th qesmoqethsh toy kaloymenoy Synhgoroy epi toy Typoy. O Synhgoros aytos den mporei na einai mia anejarthth arxh, opws symbainei me to Symboylio Radiothleorashs, poly perissotero den qa einai dhmosia yphresia h kratikos leitoyrgos. Ta idia ta Mesa Enhmerwshs, ta entypa kai oi efhmerides, mporoyn sto synolo toys, h to kaqena xwrista, na epilejoyn atomo to opoio qa epilambanetai aytwn twn qematwn kai qa kanei tis aparaithtes systaseis kai epishmanseis, gia na antimetwpizontai tetoioy eidoys fainomena. Ayto, omws, einai mia skech, einai prowro na poyme oti proxwroyme se ryqmish. Ayth th skech qa th syzhthsoyme me toys foreis ths entyphs dhmosiografias.

DHMAKAS: Ma, molis epikalesthkate th nomoqesia, to nomiko plaisio. Den arkei;

REPPAS: Ayto einai ena teleiws allo qema. Apla milhsa gia ena montelo poy yparxei kai se alles xwres poy exoyn ychlo dhmosiografiko kai enhmerwtiko politismo, an moy epitrepetai ayth h frash. Einai mia skech thn opoia exoyme logo na th syzhthsoyme me toys foreis. Nomiko plaisio yparxei kai einai isxyro. Alla blepete o qigomenos otan gia polloys logoys -kai se kapoies periptwseis noiwqei toso asqenhs h adynamos, koinwnika kai oikonomika kai den pairnei th sxetikh prwtoboylia- apofeygei na qesei ypo thn krish dikastikwn organwn to problhma poy antimetwpizei, antilambaneste pws to problhma paramenei.

DHMAKAS: Sthn "ychloterh staqmh" den fantazomai na ennoeite th bretanikh ypokrisia;

REPPAS: Anaferomai sto soyhdiko montelo, fer' eipein, to opoio leitoyrgei apotelesmatika.

Sas eyxaristw.

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